I have a friend who was raised back east (Pennsylvania and New York, I think) who drops the h from human and humor.

So do I, and I was raised in Chicago. I do this for words beginning with u followed by the long "u" or long "oo" sound. Even when I play the sound-clips in MW and AHD on-line, it's almost impossible for me to hear the h.

This is on another subject, but I used "back east" today when referring to the east coast of the U.S. When referring to the west coast of the U.S. we midwesterners say "out west."

I thought "back east" and "out west" was just used in the midwest, but those usages must be more general than that. Tinman is from Washington.

Richard sent me an article about Lynne Truss's book, and the article had one word that neither Shu nor I had seen used that way..."potty." Of course, we can understand it by context, but I wonder if it is used in England a lot.

Here is the sentence: "Before she was famous for being a stickler, Truss was famous for being single (she wrote a column for a national newspaper called Single Life in the days before such columns were commonplace) and with no one at home to stop her revelling in her achievement, she went a bit potty. Does it mean "nuts" or "crazy?"

Frankly, I think that sentence is a bit wordy, but then, I am wordy myself!

Also, a reference to an "old lady" refers to "like an old lady with wrinkled tights and smudged lipstick." Wrinkled tights? Do they mean panty hose? Panty hose don't really wrinkle anymore. Do British women wear regular stockings? I doubt it, but those wrinkle while panty hose don't. I also don't think we'd refer to "smudged lipstick." Any woman can have smudged lipstick; you don't need to be old for that.

Now, old women here might be referred to as having "blue hair" or "sensible shoes."

Kalleh,

"Potty" means, as you guessed, "nuts" or crazy".It is used only to refer to someone who is slightly crazy, and is generally used affectionally. You might say your Great Aunt Maude was potty, but not Osama Bin Laden.

"Tights" are what Americans refer to as "panty hose". As a mere male I wouldn't know about the non-wrinkling properties of modern tights/panty hose, and I suspect the author is probably a man, too. I suppose it is quite likely she is wearing stockings; I doubt the author checked.

My newspaper today showed pictures of CJ's inamorata, Britney Spears, standing in the street swigging from a miniature bottle of Scotch. The paper helpfully added that what she was doing was illegal, as the bottle was not wrapped in a brown paper bag.

That helped to clear up a minor mystery for me, as I had seen the American phrase brown-bagging, and similar, used quite often, but had never understood the reason for it, although I had been able to work out the meaning from the context.

What I still do not understand is:

• Why a brown bag? Would not a white one suffice?
• Why a paper bag? Many bags these days are made of plastic.
• Why a bag at all? Is it to stop people being offended by the sight of a bottle? Is it to stop shards of glass spraying everywhere if the drinker drops the bottle?
• In short, WHY?

I had seen the American phrase brown-bagging

Well, like most words, brown bagging can mean more than one thing. The A-H gives the two I was familiar with: the one you give (liquor in a public setting where's it's outlawed) and bring one's lunch in a brown bag, i.e., not eacting out or in a cafeteria. Another meaning online points to taking all of a person's perscription drugs to a phramacy or doctor's office for review.

I believe the alcohol meaning originating in some laws about drinking in public. Cover the offending bottle or can of hooch up and presto the police don't know and won't ask without good cause. The color and construction don't matter much as long as the contents are obscured. from public view. (Drinking outdoors at restaurants is difficult because the area has to be walled off from the rest of the world. Makes sidewalk cafes a bit strange in the US to say the least.) Silly, but then no sillier than most of society's norms. I remember my amusement at the convulted drinking hours at pubs during my first sojourn in the UK back in '76 and at the blue laws in force on Sundays in many states in the US. I seem to remember that condoms could only be sold in this country, not so long ago, if they were advertised as being for the "prevention of disease only".

> Why a paper bag? Many bags these days are made of plastic.

Not so many in the US, where supermarkets and shoppers both generally prefer tough brown-paper bags. (And see the Semantic Compositions blog passim for the pragmatics and sociolinguistics of what check-out staff really mean when they ask which you want.) Ah, and there's an American-only word in there: bagger. Even if a British supermarket has someone spare who's putting your things in bags (which makes me want to glare at them and tell them to scoot off and do a proper job, not interfere with my packing), I don't think we've got a name for them, have we? Not a polite one anyway.

In Hilo, Hawaii, the local grocery chain "Sack 'n' Save" provides brown-paper bags and invites customers to pack their purchases in them. Printed on the bags are ten benefits to be derived from sacking one's own groceries. Most memorable: "You can put the cookies on top and eat them on your way home."

So, basically, the newspaper was wrong when it said that the offending bottle had to be hidden in a brown paper bag by law?

So, basically, the newspaper was wrong when it said that the offending bottle had to be hidden in a brown paper bag by law?

No, unless US law has changed, it's illegal to carry an open, identifiable container of an alcoholic drink in public. Hence the cover-up. I assume it's still in force as I still see winos in the big city drinking beer from brown-bagged cans. (When they're not shooting heroin or reciting limericks that is. )

quote:

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Originally posted by jheem
No, unless US law has changed, it's illegal to carry an open, identifiable container of an alcoholic drink in public. Hence the cover-up.

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Actually, the laws that govern consumption of alcohol (blue laws, they are sometimes called) are different in each city, county, and state. I don't know what the laws are now, but some that I remember from bartending 25 years ago:

In one state (Oregon, I think) it was illegal to refill a glass. You had to take the glass and give the customer a clean one with each drink.

In Utah it was illegal to sell drinks in a restaurant. The restaurant would sell you the mixer -- say tonic water -- and you had to buy a little airline bottle of booze from a separate retailer.

In another state only private clubs could serve drinks, so bars became private clubs, and cover charges became 'membership dues'.

And in Texas it was legal to drive with a open container of alcohol.

I was reading about "emigrant" and "immigrant," and came across this distinction between American and British English:

"Americans offer to 'go with you to the movies', while Brits offer to 'come with you to the movies.'"

Is that the case?

Well, for a start, we wouldn't say "movies". We'd use "pictures", "cinema" or perhaps "see a film".

We probably would say "come" although "go" might also be used.

So, is the word "movie" never used in England? For example, do you have "home movies?

Quote "...So, is the word "movie" never used in England? For example, do you have "home movies?..."

We do. And the term is becoming more popular here with even the media now using the term in preference to the older "film"..

Of course, the term "movie" is more accurate since it can describe any kind of moving picture. "Film", though, should really refer only to one made with the use of photographic film (now almost extinct).

Having said which, I still prefer the older term myself.

quote:

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do you have "home movies?

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Interestingly, we do talk about "home movies", but the professional version shown on a big screen is always a "film", shown in a "cinema". We do see a lot of American-made TV programmes which refer to "movies", so the term is perfectly well known here, but not used by us unless we are trying to copy the Americans.

Whilst writing the above, I just thought of another instance of use here: one of our satellite TV channels is called "The Sky Movie Channel". Another is "Turner Classic Movies".

Whilst

Having posted here with Brits for 2 years, I have gotten used to the "honour" & "behaviour," "cinema," and the like. In fact sometimes I mistakenly put an "ou" in words.

Yet, I will never get used to "whilst."

My friends from the UK and the Antipodes use "whilst" (some of them, at least) but so far, none of them has been able to tell me what the difference is between "while" and "whilst." And since "whilst" does not exist in the USA, I can't find it in American dictionaries. Who can enlighten me on this?

This link might help to sort out while and whilst, but not much.

Thank you, Jerry. It actually DID clear things up, although the difference is not as much as I had expected...

Golly, gee-whiz, what's wrong with a little whilst, amongst, and unbeknownst to spice up the linguistic mulligatawny? I've heard some in the States use all three.

Have sometimes heard the last two in the USA, but NEVER the first.

Well, I'm a Yank and I've used whilst upon occasion, but perhaps I was just being a bit old-fashioned.

First, let me say that it is GREAT seeing you back, markmywords! We have been missing that Norway flavor.

I agree with markmywords, though. I have never seen or heard "whilst" used in the U.S., though I have seen the other 2 used.

This just in, President James Madison declared unamerican: "Of all the objections which have been framed against the federal Constitution, this is perhaps the most extraordinary. Whilst the objection itself is levelled against a retended oligarchy, the principle of it strikes at the very root of republican government." [Federalist Papers number 57] Also, President Washington's first inaugural address [New York, Aug 30, 1789] "Instead of undertaking particular recommendations on this subject, in which I could be guided by no lights derived from official opportunities, I shall again give way to my entire confidence in your discernment and pursuit of the public good; for I assure myself that whilst you carefully avoid every alteration which might endanger the benefits of an united and effective government, or which ought to await the future lessons of experience, a reverence for the characteristic rights of freemen and a regard for the public harmony will sufficiently influence your deliberations on the question how far the former can be impregnably fortified or the latter be safely and advantageously promoted."