It's ALWAYS used when referring to a period of two weeks. It's unlikely that anyone would say "I'm going for two weeks' holiday", they would almost always say "a fortnight's holiday".
Wow, wordnerd, you sound very British with "more's the pity." I agree, though, that we should use "fortnight", since we really don't have another term for "2 weeks."
Kalleh, I have to disagree with you. I don't believe two Americans out of any 20 chosen at random would be able to define "fortnight" though I do agree it's an extremely useful term.
Your use of "fourscore" led me to the dictionary to test my theory that this word was a result of Lincoln's Gettysburg Address. It might have made an interesting little factoid but, nope, it wasn't. Similar perfectly acceptable (though rarely if ever used) terms are "twoscore" and "threescore" for "40" and "60" respectively. There is no word "fivescore" though we seem to be able to use "hundred" with no problem.
And as far as sounding British ("more's the pity") is concerned, I was half hoping someone would make that same observation regarding my Prince Charles rant when I said, regarding extra-marital affairs, "The number doesn't enter into it!" That phraseology might puzzle an American listener but I have it on good authority that our British friends talk that way, as in:
"It's a Norwegian Blue! Beautiful plumage!!" "The plumage don't enter into it. It's stone dead!"
quote:Originally posted by C J Strolin: Similar perfectly acceptable (though _rarely if ever used_) terms are "twoscore" and "threescore" for "40" and "60" respectively.
Maybe "fourscore" is more familiar because of the (biblical?) use in "fourscore and ten"?
As for: "The number doesn't enter into it!", I'd regard that as perfectly normal usage. It wouldn't even occur to me that it's a British-ism.
In 1938 the British government introduced the Holidays With Pay Act which meant that all workers were entitled to a week's holiday for they would receive a week's money.
Since the previous week's pay plus the week's holiday pay meant that many workers had more money in their pockets than they had ever seen before, the great British "annual holiday" traditional started. The annual holiday is now a jealously guarded right by most salaried staff (although those of us who are self-employed may not be quite so lucky!)
One man who was highly inflential in implanting the annual holiday tradition was Billy Butlin who advertised his "holiday camps" with the slogan "A week's holiday for a week's pay" - which meant that holidaymakers could pay for the cost of the holiday with their week's holiday pay and thus didn't need to save up for it.
Richard English
Posts: 8038 | Location: Partridge Green, West Sussex, UK
Oh, it's not that I don't get vacation pay...that I do! I just am never able to find the time to take off. Our fiscal year ended this week, so I got an extra check to pay me for the 17 days vacation that I didn't have time to take. (I wish we had a crying graemlin!)
Posts: 1412 | Location: Buffalo, NY, United States
Is that four-score and seven thing from the Gettysburg Address? I was ashamed not to know much about Thomas Jefferson. I am right about this one I might feel better.
Yes, and note that "fourscore," as noted above, is one word, unhyphenated.
In discussing this board with a friend (who thought a fortnight was "two weeks and a day" thereby coming closest to the correct answer out of five people I've asked so far) the term "fourscore" also came up. He mentioned that Katherine Hepburn had recently died at the age of "fourscore and 16" (96) which is correct mathematically but I don't think I've ever seen the word "fourscore" used with anything higher than 10. Are there rules involved here? If there are, I am assuming that "fourscore-and-a-half" for "90" would violate them.
Regarding "doesn't enter into it," the one and only time I've heard that phrase was in Monthy Python's Pet Shop sketch, hence my (mistaken?) belief that it was a Britishism.
Interesting link. Both "fourscore" and "four score" would be gramatically correct. Might Honest Abe have written "four score" meaning "fourscore" and later had it altered by well-meaning editors?
quote:Originally posted by C J Strolin: And as far as sounding British ("more's the pity") is concerned, I was half hoping someone would make that same observation regarding my Prince Charles rant when I said, regarding extra-marital affairs, "The _number_ doesn't enter into it!" That phraseology might puzzle an American listener but I have it on good authority that our British friends talk that way, as in:
"It's a Norwegian Blue! _Beautiful_ plumage!!" "The plumage don't enter into it. It's stone dead!"
I noticed the Pythonesque tone but failed to make mention of it. I just assumed you'd watched it so often it had crept into your vernacular.
quote:Originally posted by C J Strolin: Interesting link. Both "fourscore" and "four score" would be gramatically correct. Might Honest Abe have written "four score" meaning "fourscore" and later had it altered by well-meaning editors?
There are apparently five surviving handwritten manuscript copies. The Nicolay Draft and the Hay draft each says "Four score," as two separate words.
Lincoln wrote out the other three drafts long after the speech had been delivered, so that the extra drafts could be used for charitable purpose. I was able to find one of them on line, and it too uses two separate words.
He mentioned that Katherine Hepburn had recently died at the age of "fourscore and 16" (96) which is correct mathematically but I don't think I've ever seen the word "fourscore" used with anything higher than 10. Are there rules involved here? =============================================== If one were to say it in French, it would work, i.e. quatre-vingt-seize, if memory serves, but it's been a loooong time since I hung around any French speakers, so I'm not entirely sure.
Also, someone said, "...the Biblical four score and ten." I don't think so! Try "...three score and ten, or four score."
I've found this rendered both as three-score (which I believe to be what the original says) and as threescore.
quote:On a Fly Drinking from His Cup William Oldys, 1696-1761
Busy, curious, thirsty fly! Drink with me and drink as I. Freely welcome to my cup, Couldst thou sip and sip it up; Make the most of life you may, Life is short and wears away.
Just alike, both mine and thine, Hasten quick to their decline. Thine's a summer, mine no more, Though repeated to three-score. Three-score summers, when they're gone, Will appear as short as one.
I will survive in the eyes of the children of the children of those who know me now as the spirit that will not be chained, who will sing a timeless, youthful song, who will live this life imperfect but beautiful and pay back (pennies on the dollar perhaps) the gift of life I’ve been loaned these few score years of mine.
. However, wordnerd's comment doesn't sound common.
