I seem to have a bad habit these days of saying "I don't recall" and "Not to my recollection," instead of "I don't remember." I have no idea how that got started because it is new. Are these 2 words "recall" and "recollection" related? From reading the online dictionaries, it looks like not. "Recollection" comes from the Latin word recolligere, meaning "to gather up," whereas "recall" just seems to come from "to call back." Yet, they seem so close to each other and they always seem to be used together.

[As an addendum but not related, I have also been using "as well," as in, "I am going, as well," instead of "too." In fact I recently read in a word column where the columnist acknowledged that "as well" is in vogue, and he pined for the use of "too."]

This hadn't occurred to me; but there are 260 Google hits for recallection, which is quite a natural spelling, exactly what you would get if the stressed vowel of call became unstressed. The semantic connexion is clear, whereas that with collect and collection is not at all.

So I would predict first that recallection will increase in frequency, and second that the apparently superfluous verb recollect will lose out to recall.

This hadn't occurred to me; but there are 260 Google hits for recallection, which is quite a natural spelling, exactly what you would get if the stressed vowel of call became unstressed.
Interesting, aput. I hadn't heard of "recallection," and it isn't in Onelook. However, you are right that it makes perfect sense.

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Originally posted by Kalleh:
I seem to have a bad habit these days of saying "I don't recall" and "Not to my recollection," instead of "I don't remember." I have no idea how that got started because it is new.

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I don't know why you consider that a bad habit. Recall and recollection are both good words. Perhaps because previously you didn't normally use them, you thought they sounded a little pretentious and unnatural.

quote:

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Are these 2 words "recall" and "recollection" related? From reading the online dictionaries, it looks like not. "Recollection" comes from the Latin word recolligere, meaning "to gather up," whereas "recall" just seems to come from "to call back." Yet, they seem so close to each other and they always seem to be used together.

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The words are related, but not etymologically as far as I know. First of all recall in "I don't recall" is a verb, whereas recollection in "Not to my recollection" is a noun. It's hard to directly compare a verb to a noun, so let's consider the verbs recall and recollect. Recall means "to call again" or, as you have noted, "to call back". Recollect means "to collect again". You've heard of people "collecting their thoughts". Sometimes they recollect them, too.

One of the definitions of recollect in the OED Online is, "To collect (one's spirits, thoughts, mind, etc.)." Another is, "To call or bring back (something) to one's mind; to recall the knowledge of (a thing, person, etc.); to remember." After that last definition the OED Online adds, "Recollect, when distinguished from remember, implies a conscious or express effort of memory to recall something which does not spontaneously rise in the mind." So there is sometimes a subtle difference between remember and recollect, though they are often used interchangeably. Recollect is (or was) often used idiomatically to express remembrance of events a person personally experienced. We all (well, many of us) can remember World War II, but only those who were alive at that time can recollect it.

Call is "Middle English, from Old Norse kalla; akin to Old English hildecalla battle herald, Old High German kallOn to talk loudly, Old Church Slavonic glasu voice", according to M-W Online. And recall is re-, back or again, plus call.

So Recall and recollect are related in that they are loose synonyms of each other. Recallection is an abomination to my mind. I suspect it started when someone misspelled recollection.

Tinman

This message has been edited. Last edited by: tinman,

Oh, it's a pure spelling error: 260 ghits is nothing, nowhere near enough to give it any legitimacy. Any mish-mash you can imagine is out there in abundance. Let's try these:

recolection: 3030
reccolection: 320
reccollection: c. 400 (filtering out some valid uses)
recollexion: 14
recullection: 1 (one!)
recollecton: 10
recllection: 57
recalection: 87

It just interested me that the false connexion to 'recall' was justifiable phonetically.

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Originally posted by aput:
Oh, it's a pure spelling error: 260 ghits is nothing,

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A new coinage !

ghits - hits by gits presumably.

just loved

sic transit googlia mundi

although I had to invent my own translation.

I have it on the authority of the eminent Dr. Hieronymus Hambershlabber that googlia by ghits are the result of mis-firing neurons.

In other words,

sic transit ganglia mundi

Uh, Bob, Hic, aren't you posting in the wrong thread?

Oh, it's a pure spelling error
Figures that I'd fall for it!

I don't know why you consider that a bad habit. Recall and recollection are both good words. Perhaps because previously you didn't normally use them, you thought they sounded a little pretentious and unnatural.

Well, Tinman, I am a little sensitive about being pretentious after everyone here told me that "read" is so much less pretentious than "peruse," which I confess to using from time to time. I don't want to be pretentious, and yet I want to use a varied vocabulary....so it can be confusing!

I have perused this entire thread..

By Monday, yikes, it's already Monday.. I will be able to recall none of it.

But, I will recollect that it was amusing...

Kalleh, I wasn't suggesting that you were pretentious to use those words, merely that perhaps you felt pretentious using them. I think you understood that's what I meant, but I wanted to make sure you knew I wasn't calling you pretentious.

Sometimes it's hard to tell if someone is being pretentious or not. Some people naturally use words which aren't famaliar to me. Others use simple words. That's just the way they talk. There's no pretentiousness involved. Some use big or unfamiliar words to show off their superior erudition and to sound important. That's pretentious. Others learn new words, like them, and decide to use them. That's not pretentious. If you feel comfortable using a word, use it.

Very witty, KHC, how you mamaged to get all three of those words in there. And I bet you don't feel pretentious.

Tinman

I think you understood that's what I meant, but I wanted to make sure you knew I wasn't calling you pretentious.
Yes, I did understand, Tinman. I am just interested in what some people call pretentious while others call it having a good vocabulary. Sometimes you can't win for losing.

Now, KHC, in your perusal of this thread, did you skim it or read in depth?

A favorite punchline:

"And so I said, 'Pretentious? Moi?!'"

Kalleh,
I read it in depth... like Esther Williams swimming... with Tarzan, no less!... I use peruse all the time! And you are correct, Tinman, I never feel pretentious...!

I yam what I yam...and I still say, "Jag-war"... for the car and the animal... and I don't know of anyone who owns either.