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Picture of Caterwauller
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I don't know that one, wordnerd, so I've searched by googling the lyrics.

Is this it? And here is the entire lyric.

I have to try to do these things before Tinny does once in a while! You know, prove my worth as a librarian! I'm sure if KHC could post more than a line, she'd do it, too!


My library doesn't own their music (gasp!). Might be a good choice for a Christmas request! Thanks for the lyric, Wordnerd!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Caterwauller,


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"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
~Dalai Lama
 
Posts: 5149 | Location: Columbus, OhioReply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Caterwauller:

I have to try to do these things before Tinny does once in a while! !

Yeah, you beat me on that one, CW.

quote:
You know, prove my worth as a librarian!!

I was beginning to wonder when you complained about having to use a dictionary!

quote:
My library doesn't own their music (gasp!)

What! My library has music and videos. Books, too, of course? Yours does have books, doesn't it?

Tinman
 
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Picture of Richard English
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Quote "...What! My library has music and videos. Books, too, of course? Yours does have books, doesn't it?..."

In fact, that is really all that a library should have. A library is, of course a place where books are kept. A lending library is a special form of library that keeps books for others to borrow.

What has happened to the word is that the "lending" prefix has gone but the lending sense has stayed and the book sense has gone. This has had the result that these days most people think of a library as being a place from which things are lent, not a place where books are kept.

A change in use I regret since there could have been plenty of words created to convey the sense of a lending establishment without hijacking a word that already had a perfectly good meaning.


Richard English
 
Posts: 8037 | Location: Partridge Green, West Sussex, UKReply With QuoteReport This Post
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Well! I hardly know what to say first! Turn my back to you fellows for a couple of days and just look what you've gotten into! Tinny is making fun of me (and my library) and Richard is relying on outdated definitions! Oh my! And I am using too many exclamation points! Someone stop me before I scream!

Ok . . . <smiles sweetly at Tinman> yes, of course my library has books . . . ummm . . . somewhere . . . wait . . . I know I just saw a book here somewhere.

I'll respond more in a bit - have to go work now.


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"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
~Dalai Lama
 
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Tinny is making fun of me (and my library) and Richard is relying on outdated definitions!

Welcome to my world, CW. Ah, well, where to begin.

As far back as I can remember (only into the '60s to be sure), public libraries in the States have housed more than books, (e.g., artwork, microprint, microfilm, microfiche, periodicals, records (tapes, CDs, LPs and 78s), videos/DVDs, computer software).

An interesting aside, early lending libraries were the subjects of litigation and violence. Seems publishers (and authors) were up in arms because not as many folks would buy their IP if these institutions didn't exist. The first lending libraries were by subscription.

I spend an awful lot of time in libraries in many different countries and can testify that they still contain a whole lotta books.
 
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OK - I just did an hour in the homework help center, and then a storytime for preschoolers (gotta love "Wheels on the Bus"). Oh now, before anyone thinks I'm angry let me just say that I know Tinny is just joshing with me. And then Richard took the chain and is yanking a bit, too!

Now, I have search for a modern, thorough definition of what a modern library is, and I have to say that I haven't found one. I think the problem is that a dictionary definition cannot do justice to what a library has become. The word library has come to mean so much more than just a place that houses books, as you've all mentioned. Let me just tell you what my own library is.

It is a place of learning, certainly. We have books and magazines and access to hundreds of journals and newspapers. My own location also provides GED tutoring, computer basics, help with small businesses, preschool storytimes, book discussion groups, and a homework help center where kids can come get help one-on-one. Much of this is beyond the scope of many public libraries even in my own system, but it is what is needed in this neighborhood.

The library is also a place for entertainment. Pleasure reading, movies, music, toys that children can use here, and computers allow us to provide our neighbors with some recreation time activities.

The library is also a place where everyone is equal. By providing access to materials and computers for free, we are helping to bridge the digital divide as well as a few material divides in our culture. Many of the people in my neighborhood have no other place where they can get access to the internet, or use WORD to type their resumes, or create power point presentations. And yes, even access sites like this discussion board!

But more than anything, the library is a place of Community. This is a building that provides meeting spaces for tutors, students working together on projects, groups that need to meet to plan reunions and other functions, and even (apparently) a place to go to pick up chicks!

I know I'm missing some things, but you get the idea. Richard, good libraries have evolved into an important part of the lives of the people they serve.

Welcome to the modern library!

(you didn't think I'd be able to resist this one, did you?)


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"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
~Dalai Lama
 
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Oh, gosh, before anybody gets to thinking that I'm angry or cross with anbody, let me assure them that I'm not. Just some old-fashioned ribbing.
 
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A change in use I regret since there could have been plenty of words created to convey the sense of a lending establishment without hijacking a word that already had a perfectly good meaning.


Please don't give them ideas, Richard. When I was growing up our school library was called, at various times, the Education Resource Center, the Media Center, the Educational Media Center, the Multimedia Educational Resource Center, the Instructional Media Center, the Instructional Resource Center...but never, ever 'the Library'.

It was not pleasant.
 
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It is a revealing fact about we folk here that a discussion of the f-word morphs into one about libraries.

Shall I laugh, cry, or rejoice?
 
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Quote "...I know I'm missing some things, but you get the idea. Richard, good libraries have evolved into an important part of the lives of the people they serve..."

Read what I said, not what you thought I said! I said I regretted the change in use of the word "library", not the change in the function of the lending library. This is because the word now no longer accurately describes the function of the establishment to which it is attached. Furthermore, its original and precise meaning has been lost with the result that we no longer have a simple word to describe a place where books are kept.

For the same reason I dislike the hijacking of the word "gay" since we now no longer have a simple word to describe a person who is of a light-hearted and carefree disposition.

When they broadened their remit, lending libraries could have changed their name to, say, lending centres, which would have more accurately descibed their function while leaving the term "library" untouched. Similarly homosexuals could have chosen a word to descibe their preferences without hijacking "gay".

I am aware, though, that the evolution of language has little to do with conscious choice and I am simply expressing my regret, not my desire to try to change anything.


Richard English
 
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Originally posted by Hic et ubique:
It is a revealing fact about we folk here that a discussion of the f-word morphs into one about libraries.

Shall I laugh, cry, or rejoice?



Rejoice!

And Richard - I hear what you're saying . . .

But think about gay. There are other words that describe a light-hearted and carefree disposition: perky, fun, fabulous, bitchin', phat, amusing, flighty . . . oh yes, and there is always "light-hearted and carefree."

I can see what you mean, though, about wanting some more simple terms to stay put.

Neveu - we've gone through what you describe at schools around here, too. Interestingly, there is an actual difference between Library Media Specialists and Librarians. KHC, working at a school library is most likely the former, with a background in education (and maybe even certification to teach, usually a slightly different Master's degree) whereas I am a simple public librarian, with just a Master's in Library Science (MLS). Of course, most folks just call anyone who works at a library a librarian, and I don't correct most people anymore . . . just for the sake of this discussion. I, personally, have come to the conclusion that the generic word "librarian" means much more than the title and educational status of "Librarian" and I don't really care what they call us all. I'm just always so glad the folks in our neighborhood are visiting us and talking to us, they can call us all just about anything they want (of course, vulgarity and obscenity will get them evicted). Big Grin I just don't want people on my staff to feel like they aren't important or good enough to be called librarians . . . and I would rather we not correct the customers right off the bat. There are sometimes things more important than telling people the precise word. (don't lynch me for saying it!)


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"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
~Dalai Lama
 
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Quote, "...There are other words that describe a light-hearted and carefree disposition: perky, fun, fabulous, bitchin', phat, amusing, flighty . . . oh yes, and there is always "light-hearted and carefree..."

Maybe in US English but in UK English "perky" means bright and chirpy, in the pink; "fun" is a noun and funny means humerous; "fabulous" correctly means mythical but is often taken to mean superb; "bitchin'" is a verb meaning complaining; "phat" has no UK meaning I know of; "amusing" means much the same as funny; "flighty" means shallow or unreliaable and is usually only applied to girls.

Not one is even a distant synonym for the proper meaning of "gay".


Richard English
 
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Similarly homosexuals could have chosen a word to descibe their preferences without hijacking "gay".

Well, I'm not sure you can use hijack when discussing words and not aeroplanes. Wink I know what you mean though, Richard. It annoys me to no end that part of the dative/ablative plural suffix for nouns in Latin was hijacked to describe a largish motor vehicle for providing public transportation: omnibus 'for all' > bus ... Not that I have anything against the anglophones what done this. In fact, just yesterday I used public transport. The point is, it happened, and I'll get over it. In fact it took place before I was born.

The only other suffix I know of that's been elevated to word status is ism.
 
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Jheehm, I stand with Richard on the use of "gay." I feel that the only way that it can be returned to its meaning is to re-appropriate it. If I, a heterosexual, proclaim myself to be in a gay mood, and thousands of others do the same around the country, eventually "gay" will again mean "merry," blithe," "cheerful," not "homosexual." And the examples of synonyms don't ring true for me, a US of American citizen, sooo, I want the word back!!!! Big Grin
 
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Originally posted by jheem: It annoys me to no end that part of the dative/ablative plural suffix for nouns in Latin was hijacked to describe a largish motor vehicle for providing public transportation: omnibus 'for all' > bus.

The only other suffix I know of that's been elevated to word status is ism.
I'm starting a new thread on this point to avoid hijacking this one, or more accurately, re-hijacking (or is it re-re-hijacking? or ... Smile).
 
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I want the word back!

Asa, the word gay still means 'merry, joyful, etc.' as well as 'whorish' and 'homosexual' (as I've said elsewhere). What's the problem? Use it with the meanings you intend. That's how language works. Not by whining but by meaning.
 
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I remember my Latin textbook at school had a poem called The Motor Bus which showed the various declensions of "motor bus" in a humorous way, by treating it as if it were Latin. I can only remember now the last three line, which went:

... Came in hordes motorem borem.
Domine, dirige nos,
Contra hos motores bos!


Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
 
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It annoys me to no end that part of the dative/ablative plural suffix for nouns in Latin was hijacked to describe a largish motor vehicle for providing public transportation: omnibus 'for all' > bus.

Oh, but jheem, doesn't language evolve? Isn't that what you have taught me (and Asa and Richard re: "gay")? Why on earth would that annoy you then? Wink

[Just pulling your leg, all in good fun...I hope!]
 
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Originally posted by Richard English:
we no longer have a simple word to describe a place where books are kept.

A bookshelf Big Grin


(I'm really, reaaally sorry Richard - I'm in a mischievous mood. Wink)
 
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K., I was being sarcastic. I am not annoyed by the bus from omnibus phenomenon, I am ecstatic!
 
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