Somewhere on this board I seem to recall presenting a list of the three greatest things to come out of England:
1.) The United States,
2.) The Beatles, and
3.) Something else which escapes me at the moment.
Allow me to amend that list and officially place Sir Alistair Cooke in that third position.

This post is a cyber-sympathy card not only to my British Wordcrafter friends but to any and all posters who had the opportunity to experience the richness of Cooke's language during the course of the past 95 years of this great man's life which, all too sadly, was cut short this week.

In the U.S., he was probably best known as the host of Masterpiece Theatre. As such he was a model of British gentility, decorum and, for lack of a better word, stiff-upper-lippidness. In short, he presented to American PBS viewers a spot-on personification of England. (And, for that matter, it was from Alistair Cooke that I first heard the term "spot-on.")

For me, however, my closest link to Sir Alistair was his long-running radio series "Letter from America." Running for 58 YEARS (My, God! What an accomplishment!) this program was exactly what the title implied, communications back home from a transplanted Manchester-ite about his observations of and dealings with his new Yankee neighbors. When he spoke of our accomplishments, it made me all that more proud of them. Conversely, when he outlined the ways in which he felt we were failing ourselves or the world in general, as he often did, it was never in a way which caused resentment.

His last "Letter from America" was broadcast about a month ago when it was explained that, on doctor's orders, he was at long, long, last putting the program to bed. I'm not ashamed to say that his goodbye moved me to tears, tears which again are welling as I type these words. His passing is a great, great loss. Sir Alistair Cooke was everyone's favorite grandfather, mentor and guide. He made you want to be a better person. And, Oh, how he could use the language!

To all those who knew him, especially those who heard/read his "Letters from America" over the years, I share with you your sadness at his passing. For those of you who never had that pleasure, Sir Alistair Cooke's Letters are and, I'm sure, always will be available in book form and, to a lesser extent, on cassette tape. I invite you to treat yourself - the Letters were written to all of us.

I agree.

Sir Alistair's letters were always interesting, always perceptive, sometimes critial but never hurtful. He will be much missed.

Interestingly, to the English ear he had a slight American accent but I understand that, to the American ear, his accent was completely Engish.

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Originally posted by Richard English:
Interestingly, to the English ear he had a slight American accent but I understand that, to the American ear, his accent was completely Engish.

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Absolutely. Sir Alistair Cooke's diction, as once reported by a fan from the deep South, was "English as she oughta be spoke." And we've covered the common American love affair with the British accent elsewhere but I might add that even we Yanks have our preferences. Sir A. would lead the list followed by, possibly, Arthur Treacher and then maybe Lady Di with Mick Jagger lingering somewhere around the bottom rung of that particular ladder.

And speaking of Mick, Americans of course also have a fascination with the whole system of British royalty. To our collective ear, "Sir Alistair Cooke" seems altogether fitting and proper and totally correct. But "Sir Mick"?? Even the strongest Anglophiles among us turn a little queasy at that.


And one last note about Sir Alistair. I was talking with a friend about his passing and mentioned that I was glad that I had heard his last broadcast but then, when I described it, he said that I was mistaken. Turns out I was. The last "Letter from America" was broadcast at least a few weeks after he announced that he was bringing the series to a close due to his doctors' strong recommendation that he do so. This was the Goodbye, such as it was, that I had heard. The very last broadcast was almost indistinguishable from any other heard this year, dealing in this case with Bush's handling (or mis-handling) of the Iraq situation but containing nothing in the way of a Goodbye to his millions of fans. This has been remarked upon as being just one more example of his great character or British reserve or whatever but, frankly, I think the tendancy might be to feel just a bit short-changed.

Or, again, maybe that's just an American perspective...

Somewhere on this board I seem to recall presenting a list of the three greatest things to come out of England: 1.) The United States, 2.) The Beatles, and
My husband wanted to visit the British Library. I humored him, thinking, "Of all the stupid things to see!" Boy was I wrong. Oh, my God. It had me in shivers throughout.

CJ's note about the Beatles made me post it here. Their notes writing their first songs were there! Amazing!

However, so were notes of Darwin's, Newton's, the Magna Carta, the first Bibles, and the original "Alice in Wonderland" in a handwritten book! I was simple in awe throughout that library.

And, whilst (yes, folks, they all say it here!), we keep hearing about how awful the American government is, it was heartwarming to find that an American saw to it that the original "Alice in Wonderland" was donated back to the British from a group of Americans who bought it for a large price for the sole purpose of returning it to its rightful country. The Americans returned it, thanking the Brits for fighting so diligently against Hitler.

I'm sorry to have to say this Kalleh but if the British Library has Lewis Carroll's (2 R's and 2 L's) original "Alice in Wonderland," they apparently have a forgery on display.

Right, B.H.?

At one time I believed that the British Library had a copy of every book ever printed in the UK. However, some years ago a schoolfriend of mine (now sadly deceased) used to work there and was responsible for their storing and shelvage.

He told me that this was not true and, furthermore, the ever-increasing numbers of books being published meant that the selection was becoming steadily more selective.

It's still a fantastic place, though - even if the new building has not got quite the same atmosphere as did the original one.

I'm sorry to have to say this Kalleh but if the British Library has Lewis Carroll's (2 R's and 2 L's) original "Alice in Wonderland," they apparently have a forgery on display.
Chris (or whatever you want to be called now),
I am not sure to what you are referring, since you just stated that it was a "forgery" with no explanation.

Perhaps my post was confusing. I am referring to Charles Dodgson's original handwritten book for Alice Liddell referring to the afternoon he spent with her when he first conceived of the lovely story. To what are you referring? The original pictures, for example, were by Dodgson and not by Sir John Tenniel. Truthfully, I saw it there.

You must be referring to something else.

Seeing original manuscripts can be thrilling. Several decades ago in the Huntington Museum in California I saw a note written around 1777 by King George III to his Ambassador in France. I can't accurately quote it but in essence it said, "Apparently the Colonists in America are serious about wanting their independence, so let's go ahead and let them have it."

Actually, the title of the original hand-written book (the one seen by Kalleh) was Alice's Adventures Under Ground. That of the professionally published version was Alice's Adventures in Wonderland.

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Originally posted by arnie:
Actually, the title of the original hand-written book was _Alice's Adventures Under Ground_.

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That's very interesting although, as a title, it suggests to me that Alice might either be a mole or recently deceased.

I'd say both "official" titles (and, for that matter, the Disney variation) are catchier but then again I prefer "Carroll" with one "L" so who am I to say?

under ground: a mole or deceased
underground: in a region beneath the ground

hm, curious

I was hoping B.H., as our Alice Expert, was going to jump in but apparetnly he's busy. Bob is in Iceland and will be gone for 2 weeks. I wanted his expertise as well!

If we are going to be really accurate, of course there is no Lewis Carroll, as it was Charles Dodgson. I bought an excellent book on Alice in Wonderland (or whatever) that I can't find in the midst of suitcases right now. However, I will find it and post more about it. There was a significant discussion in it about the name of the book; I do remember that. Also, remember, that Charles Dodgson wrote 2 books. The first was the handwritten one that he wrote specifically for Alice; it is in the British Library and has Charles's own drawings. However, when people convinced him to publish it, he embellished the story and asked Tenniel to draw the pictures.

One interesting aspect is that both Tenniel and Dodgson were extreme perfectionists. When the first 2,000 were printed for distribution, Tenniel objected as some of the drawings were too light and others too dark. Now, Dodgson had spent a lot of money getting them published, but he consented to calling them back in, and having them reprinted. Guess what happened to those 2,000 copies? They sent them to America to be sold. Now called the "suppressed editions," they are worth a fortune, and collectors are fighting over them.

[edited to reflect change from 1,000 to the correct number of 2,000.]

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kalleh,

I found my book. Arnie is correct (what else is new? ) that the original book written for Alice was entitled, "Alice's Adventures Underground." Then, he rewrote it and enlarged it, taking out private Liddell family jokes and references and adding 2 new chapters, "Pig and Pepper" and "A Mad Tea Party," renaming it "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland." Some of the other titles he considered were: "Alice Among the Elves/Goblins," "Alice's Hour in Elfland" and "Alice's Hour/Adventures in Wonderland." Then, of course, the sequel was named, "Through the Looking-Glass, and What Alice Found There."

My book, "The Original Alice" by Sally Brown (published by the British Library) says that the appearance of goblins appears strange, since they do not feature in the published story. However, "grinning goblin faces are to be found in Dodgson's early sketches for the original version (for which no draft has survived), preserved at Christ Church" College at Oxford. When she says "no draft has survived," I am confused. Is it of the early sketches? If so, what then is preserved at Christ Church?

The British Library has one of the very few surviving copies of the first edition of "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland."

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kalleh,

Actually I was only away for eight days and I'm back now.

(It was a great trip by the way - we saw an amazing display of the Northern Lights among other treats.)

My facsimile edition of Dodgson's original version has his facia page illustration in which the title is "Alice's Adventures under Ground" (with that peculiar capitalisation). What significance this has, if any, I'm not sure.

Oh yes, nearly forgot, I also now have an Icelandic edition of Lísa Í Undralandi.