As I was driving to my conference center here in Vermont, I was listening to NPR where they were talking about definitions of paired words, such as rant and rave. For that one, their differentiating characteristic was that raving can get out of control more so than ranting, which is continuous. I thought that was a little lame.

However, the one that really interested me was arts and crafts. Now, before discussing this one, please, let's not make this a discussion of "what is art," okay? Thanks! Anyway, they said the dictionary's difference was that crafts takes manual dexterity, while arts don't. They thought that was a stupid differentiation, so they came up with crafts are utilitarian, but art isn't. I'm not sold on that either. Thoughts?

The basic difference is you can't convince a potential inveztor that the million he spends buying a craft today will be worth two million next week.

I suppose it depends on the language. In Classical Greek, τεχνη (tekhne) covered both arts and crafts. In English, between arts and crafts you might find folk art. Also, in English, there is a further complication in that there was a specific aesthetic and artistic movement called the Arts and Crafts Movement (link). The difference seems to be mainly one, these days, of audience. Crafts (handicrafts, folk art, industrial design) and art (high art) are both targetted at and being consumed by people at different ends of the socio-economic spectrum. It doesn't really have to do with economics, though, as some folk art or traditional crafts are quite rare, collectible, and desirable, e.g., scrimshaw or some Native American items). Crafts are usually associated with handmade items based on somewhat old-fashioned techniques. Although, there are still artists using oil paints rather than acrylics.

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This message has been edited. Last edited by: zmježd,

When we talk about arts and crafts nowadays it's usually a fixed expression, derived - I'm sure - from its more restricted use to name the Arts and Crafts (capital A and C) movement.

I'd say that its connection to either the wider use of the word "arts" or the wider use of the word "crafts" is quite loose. As a fixed expression it seems to be used to refer to anything that is nominally functional (a wicker basket, a decorated bucket, a ceramic tile etc) but which has been decorated or designed in such a way that its function has become secondary to its form. The "arts and crafts" label thus refers to something from a tradition of crafts (utility) that has been modified by a tradition of arts (decoration) and the phrase shouldn't be analysed in terms of its constituent parts, but rather as a single lexical item.

Just my opinion.

I'd also apply a similar "single item" analysis to other paired phrases such as "hither and yon" (or "hither and thither" as it's sometimes presented in my local dialect), "beck and call", "rant and rave". Where the phrase is customarily used as a whole, that's the way that it ought to be analysied.

rant and rave

These are called collocations in corpus linguistics. Sometimes they are idiomatic and irreversible. These are called irreversible binomials or Siamese twins. Oftentimes they use meter and alliteration or rhyme.

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Crafts (handicrafts, folk art, industrial design) and art (high art) are both targetted at and being consumed by people at different ends of the socio-economic spectrum.

True, to a certain extent.

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It doesn't really have to do with economics, though, as some folk art or traditional crafts are quite rare, collectible, and desirable, e.g., scrimshaw or some Native American items).

But that statement shows it is an economic issue. The expensive crafts are costly because they are "rare" (one-of-a-kind)and thus something an investor would like, or "collectible" and "desirable", again an investible commodity. So some crafts (usually due to their antiquity and history) are valuable and costly. But these items are not as available or common as paintings and sculptures (art) and don't sell for fantastically-inflated prices.

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Crafts are usually associated with handmade items based on somewhat old-fashioned techniques. Although, there are still artists using oil paints rather than acrylics.

Oil paintings aren't considered crafts. And oil isn't old-fashioned today. Many artists still use it. Acrylics is a middle ground between oil and watercolors with its own techniques, and is not a substitute for either.

The earlier comment that crafts require manual dexterity while art does not shows the writer never tried to paint or sculpt. A painter has to be able to draw and a sculptor needs a fine touch with his chisel to be successful (usually).

I once tried my hand at watercolors but as Clint Eastwood said in a Dirty Harry movie, “A man has to know his limitations.”

But that statement shows it is an economic issue.

Sure, it's an economic issue, but it does not distinguish arts from crafts. It's not a property of the piece itself, but a side issue. If I pay a whole bunch of money for a piece of land, that in itself does not make it a piece of art.

Oil paintings aren't considered crafts.

Sorry I was a bit ambiguous. What I meant was that some would consider oil painting an old-fashioned art. So that old-fashioned techniques don't necessarily distinguish between arts and crafts.

I really don't think there is much difference between arts and crafts, except perhaps that the former are valued more than the latter, and not necessarily in a monetary sense.

To my mind, crafts are necessarily items. Art can be anything that someone decides is art. As has often been noted here, John Cage's musical composition, 4'33" is considered by some to be art, even though it is no more than a period of silence.

I doubt whether anyone in the crafts movement would consider that an empty space on a display table would ever be considered a "craft" (although I am sure that someonce would try to claim it is art - if indeed that has not already happened).

People seem to be missing my point though.

"Arts" is a lexical item with a meaning (however difficult we find that meaning to pin down).
"Crafts" is another, different lexical item with a different and meaning.
"Arts and Crafts" is a third and also different lexical item with its own meaning.

In this case you might derive the meaning from the constituent parts but not necessarily.

Yes, Bob, I see your point. Don't you think, though, that "arts and crafts" are quite similar to just plain "crafts?" What do you see as the difference?

Crafts is making a pot to pour water out of. Arts and crafts is making it pretty as well.

We often have sidewalk days (indeed, they are on this weekend in Winnetka), and there are lots of arts and crafts...or just plain crafts...on sale. They'd be things like homemade jewelry (not expensive) or clocks made out of tiles or tie dyed shirts, etc. I'd call them arts and crafts or just plain crafts. Perhaps there is a UK/US difference in this.