Webster's Collegiate Dictionary has stirred a bit of a tempest by adding the word McJob, which it defines as "a low-paying job that requires litle skill and provides little opportunity for advancement".

McDonald's corporation has protested. Of the numerous news articles, I'm including a link to one from the Boston Globe.

I think the outrage McDonald's is expressing is hilarious. After they coined over a dozen "McWords" themselves (McRibs, McMuffins, etc.) it was only natural that others would do likewise.

Some 15 years ago Robin Williams included a couple he had coined regarding a conversation with a pushy McDonald's employee trying to sell him some McItems that he didn't want. His response: "Just give me my McChange and let me get the McF--k outa here!"


(Come to think of it, I still have that album somewhere. On vinyl, which could make it 20 or 25 years old. Flime ties!)

I say it's a Krok!

The fact of the matter is, at this point there is no changing the reputation of working at McDonald's. How many times has someone jokingly said to a kid that if he doesn't go to college, he'll be "flippin' burgers" or asking, "Do you want fries with that?" While McDonald's isn't referred to in those instances, everyone knows who they mean.

To say that McJob is insulting those with disabilities is ridiculous. I also agree with the Boston Globe that you can't just say a word isn't a word and take it out of the dictionary.

There's a boom in yuppie building construction in the hills around here. These 5,000 sq. ft. houses are commonly referred to as McMansions.

My earlier post points out that Ray Krok, NOT a member of the McDonald family, owns McDonald's, and has for many years. One doesn't hear the actual founders of the franchise protesting. Therefore, it's just Mr. Krok being pissy. Kind of a tempest in a pee pot.

quote:

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Though Doug Coupland often gets credit for coining McJob, he didn't join the chorus till 1991, when his best-selling novel "Generation X" made McJobs one element of the post-boomer cohort's disaffection. The term spread rapidly, and in 1993 the American Dialect Society, at its annual meeting, voted it "most imaginative" of the year's buzzwords.

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That's where I first read it. I understood it to have the connotation that a McJob was just a job a person got to get enought cash together to go do something else they really wanted to: visit Tibet, drive across the US, volunteer in Chile, work on a charter fishing boat, you name it. The jobs weren't confined to being at McDonald's. I can't double check because I've loaned my copy my younger sister who's started reading a lot. I'm happy for her, but I want my damn book!

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I am familiar with the works of Pablo Neruda!--Bart Simpson
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quote:

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Krok, NOT a member of the McDonald family, owns McDonald's, and has for many years. One doesn't hear the actual founders of the franchise protesting. Therefore, it's just Mr. Krok being pissy.

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Well, not quite: Mr. Kroc died almost twenty years ago. (It was mentioned in the news when his widow passed away last month.) But your point still stands.

Mr. Kroc died almost twenty years ago.
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Oh. Kroc kroaced. Am I edified!

Back when Krok died, one of the jokes that made the rounds had to do with whether he had made the grade Pearly Gates-wise or whether he was presently in a warmer clime. The punchline (such as it was) postulated that he was somewhere in-between in an area that "keeps his hot side hot and his cool side cold," a reflection of the slogan for their burger packaging at the time.

If there's any justice in the universe, he's in McLimbo.

McLimbo? Nah. They took him to Idaho and buried him in a Sim-plot.

(In case y'all don't know, Simplott is Idaho's biggest spud farm/factory, and the main supplier to fast food chains)

This from an English language French on-line paper:

French McDonald's New P.R. Twist?

Could the archetype of "fast-food" be telling us to slow down? Well, not exactly, -- but, in a
surprising move, they did suggest their French consumers eat fewer "Big Macs".

Apparently, the French division of McDonald's has run a series of ads telling parents not to let their
kids eat at McDonald's more than once a week.

The advertising agency that developed the campaign, Euro RSCG Worldwide, told Assocated Press
that the advertisements were intended to show mom’s how "McDonald's meals are part of a balanced
weekly diet." However, amid the quotes from specialists addressing obesity and proper diets for
children, the ads included a quote from a nutritionist who said, ``there's no reason to abuse fast food,
or visit McDonald's more than once a week.''

The AP reported that the parent company, US-based McDonald's Corp., "strongly disagreed'' with
the French nutritionist.

quote:

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Originally posted by Asa Lovejoy:
The AP reported that the parent company, US-based McDonald's Corp., "strongly disagreed'' with the French nutritionist.

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The fact that the spokesperson for the parent company weighed 350 pounds was not considered significant.


At the ripe ol' age of 51, I can just barely remember carnivals of my very early youth with sideshows that featured, to use the very un-PC term of the day, "freaks." I don't recall ever seeing anyone bite the head off of a live chicken (that little stunt apparently went out of favor before WW2) but I do distinctly recall gazing in wonder at the "Fat Lady." While today's carnival (when you can even find one) is a much tamer affair, it makes you wonder just what tonnage would be required for a person to fill that slot nowadays. Much to our collective shame, most American families have at least one "Fat Lady" or "Fat Man" and, even more shamefully, they're no longer even considered all that unusual.

Thank you McDonald's.

I know that this post will sound as if I have major stock in McDonald's; I assure you, I don't.

However, it does depend on what you put into your mouth. Even McDonald's, in moderation, isn't that bad. The problem is that people supersize everything & go to McDonalds way too often.

There is some personal responsibility here.

When I was teaching, I was at a university that had a Ronald McDonald's House for the parents of children with cancer. McDonald's did a wonderful job providing a homelike atmosphere for parents of dying children. Just know that McDonalds isn't all bad.

Ronald McDonald's House for
the parents of children with cancer.
_________________________________________________
Kalleh, it's called a tax write-off.

Asa the cynic

I'm going to get all heretical here and support Kalleh on this one.

McDonalds and Budweiser have something - quite a lot actually - in common. They both produce products which are not especially palatable and sell them by slick advertising to a public who, by and large, swallow the advertising line with a lot more ease than the actual products.
However no-one forces anyone at gunpoint to eat McDonalds any more than they force them to drink Budweiser.
The human palate rapidly becomes accustomed to the taste of whatever it is fed so that while I personally may not like Bud at all and wouldn't often venture into a McDonalds many people like both.

This is their choice.

The questions of whether McDonalds can be held responsible for obesity or Budweiser for alcoholism and hangovers are perfectly ludicrous. IF - and it's a very big "if" - either company were to be illegally adding addictive drugs to their wares then yes they would be responsible, but they aren't. Sugar and salt are not, in the conventional use of the word, addictive.

People eat BigMacs and drink Bud because they want to. If they eat and drink them, or anything else, to excess then that is their personal responsibility. If I bought one of CJ's super duper knives and used it to cut my throat no-one would hold him to be guilty of murder.

One of the big problems with the world today - in the UK as much as the US - is this refusal of people to take personal responsibility which has resulted in the "blame" culture that we see all around us.

Whatever goes wrong people start to bleat "it's not my fault" and look around for some other scapegoat and the lawyers make a lot of money.

Why should I let the toad work
Squat on my life ?
Can't I use my wit as a pitchfork
And drive the brute off ?
Read all about my travels around the world here.
Read even more of my travel writing and poems on my weblog.

If I bought one of
CJ's super duper knives and used it to cut my throat no-one would hold him to be
guilty of murder.

And then:
One of the big problems with the world today - in the UK as much as the US - is this
refusal of people to take personal responsibility which has resulted in the "blame"
culture that we see all around us.

Bob, these two statements are at odds with one another. Indeed, here in the USA, some hysterical group WOULD indeed hold CJ accountable. Viz suits against handgun manufacturers for murders committed by users of those guns.

As Shakespears wrote, "Lord, what fools these mortals be!"

Did he or she really weigh 25 stone! That's pretty big even by US standards!

Richard English

The holidays are around the corner, I'm far too busy selling my super duper knives (and thanks for the plug, B.H.) to be devoting much time here, PLUS yesterday began my return to a only-posting-once-a-week-on-Mondays schedule, but I came up to confirm something I had read on another thread and, once again, I now find myself sucked back into an interesting debate, and maybe we should start a thread addressing run-on sentences but I'll let someone else start it because this is something I am seldom guilty of.


Now. Yes, Asa, I definitely agree that the tax benefits play a large part in McDonald's charities. If there were no governmental incentives for the very worthwhile "Ronald McDonald House," I doubt it would exist. I could be wrong but what you lable cynicism, I see as simply economic reality.

And Yes, Kalleh, as charities go, this one is better than almost any you could name. How can you knock a program which helps kids with cancer? Then again, I see similarities between this and the recent flap about the Ku Klux Klan wanting to join Missouri's "Adopt-a-Highway" program. For those of you not familiar with this (though I'd bet something similar exists in the U.K.) under this program an organization, usually a school or business or social club, "adopts" a stretch of highway which they then keep clean by picking up litter a certain number of times a year. In exchange, they get to have their name on a sign proclaiming that it's "their" highway. Realistically speaking, it shouldn't matter who does the work just as it shouldn't matter why the McDonald houses exist.

And everybody else, the huge difference between guns and knives is that the sole purpose of guns is to wound or kill while knives can accomplish a thousand different tasks besides, yes, those two. I do bear this in mind when selling since, as B.H. rightly says, everyone should be responsible for his or her own actions, BUT I do believe that I am not automatically in the clear should someone misuse the product I sell.

Case in point: While doing a demo for a very nice woman her punk wanna-be kid (15 years old, dirty, rude, slouchy, smart mouth, hat on sideways, etc etc) stood sullenly in the corner watching the show. When I mentioned to her that our butcher knife would easily go right through a coconut (which is true; I've seen it, but be sure you drain the thing first) the punk spoke up for the first time - "Gee, that would take someone's hand right off!" I agreed that, well, yes it would but that we really didn't use that as a selling point. At the end, the woman ordered a few knives that she needed and the kid talked her into ordering a damn butcher knife which, based on how she cooked, she didn't need. I then talked her out of ordering the knife, much to the puzzlement of the kid, since I had little doubt that this moron would try to play the tough guy role with it downtown. So my commission was lower. No big deal. I haven't been sued yet and intend to keep that record as is.

And finally, R.E., I should have put quotation marks around the word "fact" to indicate I was joking. But sadly, no, 350 pounds is not all that huge by U.S. standards anymore. Do supermarkets in the U.K. offer battery-operated riding shopping carts? They apparently started out, as proclaimed on each one, "For our handicapped friends" but are now primarily used by people who are just too damn fat to walk up and down the aisles.

I do believe that the U.S., for all its faults, is the greatest country in the world but, my God, perfect we ain't!

CJ, "greatest country in the world" we ain't either!

Asa, tax write-offs can be made in a variety of ways. The Ronald McDonald's House happens to be one of the best ever. Johnson and Johnson's recent campaign "Be a Nurse" is similar. In fact, the latter campaign may have even come from a court mandate after a lawsuit, though that fact I haven't been able to validate. Yet, it is a wonderful program, bringing more young people into nursing than ever before...at a time of a severe nursing shortage. I am on the board of a nursing disabilties group, and we needed some seed money. I only had to make a few quick calls to Johnson and Johnson, send them a 3-page request, and we had $5,000 in a week. Do the ends justify the means? I don't know.

However, regarding gun laws, I am more sure of my thoughts! (Yes, you have hit a nerve; remember my kids were involved in a school shooting where any sane country would have kept the guns from the hands of this schizophrenic woman.) The gun companies are negligent in their manufacture and distribution of guns. They manufacture plastic guns that cannot be picked up in security systems, only useful to criminals. Likewise, those multiple shooting handguns (I can't think of what they are called) are only meant for criminals. Further, companies don't work hard enough on safety features. Worst of all, the distributors sell them without the necessary legal information from the buyer. The schizophrenic woman I spoke of had had many run-ins with the law and never should have been able to buy a gun. If lawsuits are the only way to get these jerks to stop assisting our criminals, so be it.

Interestingly, I was a prospective juror for a city of Chicago case against a suburban gun store. When they asked me my thoughts about gun control, Ohhhhh how I wanted to lie! However, I told the truth and was immediately dismissed.

Wow!

So many interesting topics in this thread!

CJ, Kalleh: I always like to steal an idea from... (ahem) PARAPHRASE Winston Churchill and say "The US is the worst country in the world...except for all the other countries." (R.E.? Boozy Churchill over any version of Bush anyday!)

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Likewise, those multiple shooting handguns (I can't think of what they are called) are only meant for criminals.

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Automatic or semi-automatic, I think. I was on a bank robbery jury (five counts with five related weapons charges) where the guy used a Tek-9. As soon as we were sequestered with the evidence, we all ran over to hold the gun. (It had the appropriate locks, etc. in place). The few people on the jury who did have some experience with guns were adamant about the fact that the only thing a gun like that is used for is to scare or kill someone. There is no other use for a weapon like that.

quote:

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Then again, I see similarities between this and the recent flap about the Ku Klux Klan wanting to join Missouri's "Adopt-a-Highway" program. For those of you not familiar with this (though I'd bet something similar exists in the U.K.) under this program an organization, usually a school or business or social club, "adopts" a stretch of highway which they then keep clean by picking up litter a certain number of times a year. In exchange, they get to have their name on a sign proclaiming that it's "their" highway.

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I believe that same problem occurred in Texas a few years ago. The KKK was not allowed to "Adopt-A-Highway". My thoughts were, "Of course not, if they did, people like me would drive out of their way to throw trash on it, thus defeating the purpose." But at the same time, my li'l Free Speech/Civil Liberties heart was like, "Is it right to not let them do it, just because I disagree with everything they stand for?"

Also, the organization itself doesn't do the upkeep. They pay a fee that subsidizes the people that clean up. Usually, from what I've seen and heard, the folks that clean are those sentenced to community service.

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But sadly, no, 350 pounds is not all that huge by U.S. standards anymore.

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On a more personal note, I used to weigh over 300 lbs. myself. I've lost around a hundred pounds and kept it off for about two years now. Wanna know what the most helpful thing I did was?

I stopped eating fast food. Heh. And if any of you need help in not eating fast food like McD's? Read Fast Food Nation.

Congratulations, WinterBranch! I loved "Fast Food Nation." It was a little preachy, but, still, it was loaded with wonderful facts.

As far as 350# people being rare, sadly that is not the case in the U.S. I mean, you don't come across them everyday. However, I saw people weighing at least 350#, and more, on a regular basis when I was teaching students in the hospital.

nd finally, R.E., I should have put quotation marks around the word "fact" to indicate
I was joking. But sadly, no, 350 pounds is not all that huge by U.S. standards
anymore.
_________________________________________________

I am aquainted with the Director of Product Development at a large regional fast food chain here in the Northwest. His weight? At LEAST 350 pounds!
________________________________________________

As for guns vs knives, have you seen Michael Moore's movie, Bowling for Columbine? In it he notes that Canada has higher gun ownership per capita than the USA, but about .01% or the gun murders. It ain't the weapon that kills, but the violent attitude that kills, as CJ wisely noted regarding the punk kid. My hat's off to you, CJ! BTW, do you do mail order? I'm in need of a decent set of kitchen knives! Contact me via PM.

Is the gun crime figure per capita? If not, then an adjustment needs to be made as Canada's population is less than the USA's.

Richard English

To return to our muttons (or perhaps our beefburgers), one of my favourite sites, Michael Quinion's World Wide Words has a good article on the subject of the McJob.

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It ain't the weapon that kills, but the violent attitude that kills

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Yes, I hear that from the NRA members all the time. There is a flaw in that logic. First, the bullet really is the cause of death. After all, a 5-year old finding his dad's handgun and accidently shooting his 3-year-old brother is hardly doing so because of his "violent" personality; he is curious. Yet, sadly, those kinds of deaths occur every day because we don't have good safety mechanisms, and related laws (partly because of the NRA), on guns.

But, secondly and much more importantly, we need to keep these automatic (thanks, WinterBranch!) handguns out of the hands of known criminals and uncontrolled, psychotic people. Other countries do this, and there is absolutely no reason we can't.

An interesting sidenote to all of this is that Charlton Heston graduated from our local high school. That really is quite ironic since it was our community that experienced one of the first in a long line of elementary school shootings, completely because of the lax gun laws in the U.S.

[This message was edited by Kalleh on Wed Nov 26th, 2003 at 9:51.]

Contact me via PM.[/QUOTE]
Done.

And well done, WB! Along with anyone who successfully stops smoking, I have great respect and admiration for those people who can manage to trim down so well. Taco Bell is my downfall. < shame face >


Regarding guns, does anyone remember when comedian Pat Paulsen ran for the presidency in the 1960's (under the Straight-Talking American Government, or STAG, Party) featuring a novel look at our obsession with guns? To paraphrase from one of his campaign speeches:


Guns don't kill people. Bullets kill people. Elect me president and I'll issue everyone a gun but we're gonna lock up all the bullets!

Really, though. America needs guns. Where would we be without them? If you were to come home to find another man making love to your wife, what are you supposed to do, poison him? ("Here, Buddy, get up from there and drink this!") And what about suicide? There's nothing more ridiculous than the sight of someone trying to beat himself to death with a stick!


As I'm sure you're aware, he didn't win...

I always chuckled at Pat Paulsen's battle cry: "WE CAN'T STAND PAT !"

Not doubting that Paulsen said it, but he wasn't the first. In the 1960 presidential debates, Richard Nixon repeatedly pounded on the refrain, "America cannot stand pat" -- which must have been unpleasant to his wife Patricia.

(Particularly when he added, "It is essential that we not just hold our own.")

Going back to the obesity theme in this thread, I read some interesting statistics in a "USA Today" newspaper when I was traveling earlier this month. The article was entitled, "Junk Food Super-Sizing Europeans." Look at these statistics:

Percentage of children overweight/obese (from the International Obesity Task Force):
Italy - 36%
Spain - 30%
U.K. - 22%
Denmark - 18%
France - 18%
Sweden - 18%
Finland - 13%
U.S.A. - 15%

Percentage of adult population considered obese in the same countries (Organization of Economic and Cultural Development):

U.K. - 22%
Spain - 13%
Finland - 11%
Denmark - 10%
Sweden - 9%
France - 9%
Italy - 9%
U.S.A. - 31%

Now, they do not define overweight or obesity in the article. Still, the childhood obesity in Europe is very unsettling.

quote:

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As far as 350# people being rare, sadly that is not the case in the U.S. I mean, you don't come across them everyday. However, I saw people weighing at least 350#, and more, on a regular basis when I was teaching students in the hospital.

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Oh, Kalleh! Maybe it's different where you live, but even at my heaviest? Plenty of people were far larger than me.

Men, women. Children, even. I wish that I was making some of that up.

Hmmm as far as guns....

Well, I don't know much about them except that I don't like them and they frighten me. Anyone can kill anyone, anytime, anyday. Guns are efficient--they make killing easy.

Could I shove a knife into someone? Maybe. Probably. I imagine that it would be visceral and that there would be a thousand little things that would be upsetting and difficult. Could I do it? I don't believe in saying never.

Can I exert pressure on a small please of metal? Yup. Very easy. Without thinking twice.

Efficiency is our curse and our blessing as a Homo sapiens.