In the thread on The Reliability of Polls Kalleh has edited the first two choices from Absolutely/Never to Yes/No and that's reminded me that even with words this simple there are rarely any true synonyms in English.

In this case to me "absolutely" suggests"yes, I'm surprised you had to ask" while "never" suggests "no, I'm shocked that you even asked".

Polls and pollsters are inherantly unreliable as they are always influenced, intentionally or not, by the bias of the question complier.

For example other ways of putting it (and their translations) might be

Well, yes
Well, no

(Yes, but I'm abit ashamed and don't like to talk about it / no but it's only because I've never had the chance)

Of course
Of course not

(Yes, hasn't everybody/ no, do people really do that?)

Definitely
Definitely not

(Actually no but I'm lying about it to sound cool/ Actually yes but I'm lying just in case my wife gets to hear about it)

And as a PS if I disappear from the site it's because I've had a fit of temper and thrown my computer through the window. This post has taken nine attempts and just over an hour to make because since that lightning strike my machine drops my internet connection at random intervals - eight times so far this morning.


Aaaaarrrgggghhhhhhhhh !

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BobHale,

Oh dear! I'm glad you got the post through, but sorry to hear about your lightening trouble!

thanks, though, for the giggles

When I had an eposode of email crashes I took to composing my postings in Word and then copying and pasting them. That way I always had a copy, even if it didn't go through on the first attempt.

It's a bit of a pain but far less of a pain than losing one's whole posting.

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composing my postings in Word and then copying and pasting them

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Damn! I was going to say that!

I do that too when I'm composing e-mails from a Web-based site, especially since most of my e-mails (and written letters) are more like novels.

Try getting your street struck by lightning again, Bob. It might reverse the damage.

(Disclaimer - what I've just said is rubbish).

And as a PS if I disappear from the site it's because I've had a fit of temper and thrown my computer through the window. This post has taken nine attempts and just over an hour to make because since that lightning strike my machine drops my internet connection at random intervals - eight times so far this morning.

Oh, gosh, Bob, that sounds so frustrating! Yes, try putting your posts into Word. Good idea, Richard.

I have to admit, I was surprised by all the comments on the way CJ's and even my (quite clear, in my view!) polls were constructed. I mean, these were forum polls. These aren't going to direct science or social policy. I would think it a transatlantic difference, but there were complaints on both sides of the pond. Strange.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kalleh,

Quote "...I mean, these were forum polls. These aren't going to direct science or social policy..."

Indeed no. But if they are seeking useable data (as CJ's was) then they should be as reliable as possible. Extraneous commentary detracts from their utility.

The poll about sex in the workplace, on the other hand, is simply fun and it is highly unlikely that its results will do more than amuse, astound or gratify.

But if they are seeking useable data

What surprised me about CJ's post was that he had already posted the same question on his forum, and then came here to give us the "correct answer" from his poll on his forum. I think we wordcrafters deserve more respect than that!

Richard, I think the very same data would have been obtained (in any of the polls) no matter which way the questions were asked. The meat of the questions were there; the way they were asked was varied. However, I fear I am beating a dead horse here....

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Richard, I think the very same data would have been obtained (in any of the polls) no matter which way the questions were asked.

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The same data weren't obtained. I didn't answer the first because none of the answers applied. I did answer the second. There were only five responses to the first poll at the time of writing and seven (not much of an improvement, I know) to the second.

Quote "...Richard, I think the very same data would have been obtained (in any of the polls) no matter which way the questions were asked. The meat of the questions were there; the way they were asked was varied. ..."

It has been my unenviable task, for some 28 years, to write questions for examinations and for other purposes. I can assure you that the way in which a question is asked can have a very, very significant affect on the answers given and the data thus derived.

That "the meat" is the same matters not; it is the overall composition and cooking of the "the meal" that is the main determining factor in the result.

I have to agree with you, Richard! It's been a while, but I studied a little bit about how to write a survey so you get the information you want, and so you bias the answers as little as possible. The wording of the questions has a great deal to do with how neutral and effective (as research) the poll is.

Oy. Now you're getting all professional on me. Of course, it depends on how you ask a question on questionnaires. Heck, I work at an organization that writes and administers a major professional exam. I know what goes into the writing of the items, the psychometrics, the cultural and other reviews. You're right, it does make a difference.

Still, this little forum poll should hardly be judged in the same way. If people here don't know the difference between "absolutely" or "never," well, then we have bigger fish to fry than debating these polls!

I think people knew very well what both this poll and CJ's first poll were all about. They were just being persnickety.

Quote "... think people knew very well what both this poll and CJ's first poll were all about. They were just being persnickety..."

Maybe. But I for one saw no reason why I should admit, in a poll, to something that was not accurate and that suggested that I was stupid. Humorous it might be to some; irritating it surely was to others.

The way questions are framed plays a huge part in politics:

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Or take gay marriage, which the right has made a rallying topic. Surveys have been done that say Americans are overwhelmingly against gay marriage. Well, the same surveys show that they also overwhelmingly object to discrimination against gays. These seem to be opposite facts, but they're not. "Marriage" is about sex. When you say "gay marriage," it becomes about gay sex, and approving of gay marriage becomes implicitly about approving of gay sex. And while a lot of Americans don't approve of gay sex, that doesn't mean they want to discriminate against gay people. Perfectly rational position. Framed in that way, the issue of gay marriage will get a lot of negative reaction. But what if you make the issue "freedom to marry," or even better, "the right to marry"? That's a whole different story. Very few people would say they did not support the right to marry who you choose. But the polls don't ask that question, because the right wing has framed that issue.
Framing the Issues

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On humorously worded polls, I have no trouble selecting answers that imply I'm stupid. That's all part of the humour. In answering the question you're forced to have a little laugh at yourself.

Maybe this is an Aussie characteristic -- perhaps even related to the tall poppy syndrome.

Hey - If I only did things that were guaranteed not to make me look stupid . . . I'd have to stop working with kids!

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Originally posted by Virge:
Framing the Issues

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Very interesting article. Thanks.

Tinman

Yes, great article, Virge. It is precisely why the Democrats have so many problems campaigning (and winning)!

On humorously worded polls, I have no trouble selecting answers that imply I'm stupid. That's all part of the humour. In answering the question you're forced to have a little laugh at yourself.

Well, what do you know, finally a non-American who also thought CJ's poll was funny! I was beginning to get a complex!

Now, if I only knew what the tall poppy syndrome is....

virge: Maybe this is an Aussie characteristic -- perhaps even related to the tall poppy syndrome.
Kalleh: Now, if I only knew what the tall poppy syndrome is....

I found this while researching this week's theme. What in tarnation is the tall poppy syndrome?

You've waited nearly two years for this Kalleh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tall_poppy_syndrome

lol arnie. She wanted a definition, not a dissertation! That's wikipedia for ya.

Thanks, Arnie. One would think I might have asked again, huh?