Consider these two, perfectly OK, sentences.

He won't like me adding to his problems.

He won't like my adding to his problems.

The second is a little old-fashioned perhaps and maybe even a little pompous sounding to modern ears but...

I understand the construction. "My" is possessive and "adding to his problems" is a noun phrase containing a gerund. Rather as if I'd said "He won't like my input."

But what of the first? How do we parse that sentence. It's the more modern way but I'm struggling to come up with a way to explain the grammar of it beyond shrugging my shoulders and saying "it's idiomatic".

Any ideas?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BobHale,

I think it is a perfectly good construction, not idiomatic at all.

He (subject) won't like (verb phrase) me (indirect object) adding (verb of the indirect object) to his problems.

A similar usage might be: (referring to a picture) "Here I am, adding to the mess."

I agree that it's a perfectly good construction, but the analysis presented doesn't work. "Me" is an object pronoun and therefore cannot be the subject of a verb and "adding" is not a finite verb in the way that "add/adds/added" is and can only be made so by the addition of the verb "to be" "am adding/is adding etc" to produce a continuous form.

Taken out of this structure "Me adding" is Bizarro language. (For anyone who used to read Superman comics, that reference will make sense.) "Me is/am adding" would be just as bad.

I'm trying to come up with a plausible grammatical analysis for the structure and so far haven't seen one that cuts it for me.

Oh yes, I also meant to say, nice to see you around jo.

A very useful article, goofy. I knew someone here would find one. It doesn't get me much further in my attempts to grammatically describe the sentence but it does give a lot of useful insight into why both forms are fine.

Further thoughts/links anyone?

quote:

Originally posted by BobHale:
But what of the first? How do we parse that sentence. It's the more modern way but I'm struggling to come up with a way to explain the grammar of it beyond shrugging my shoulders and saying "it's idiomatic".

Actually both constructions are equally old, at least in writing. And you're not the first to wonder about it, MWDEU mentions all the commentators who have been baffled by the constructions.

If I could afford The Cambridge Grammar to the English Language I could look it up there. It seems to me that you just have a verb like with 2 complements: me and adding to his problems. The reason that me adding is bizarro language out of context is because it's not a single constituent, it's 2 constituents. my adding is a single constituent.

Now that's definitely moving me on towards a sensible analysis.

He won't like (me) (adding to...) as a verb with two separate, but related objects

and

He won't like (my adding to...) as a verb with a single object.

I seem to be groping in the right direction here. I'm going to give it some more thought now.

Hmmm.
I was about to post

quote:

I wonder if I could make a case for it being an elliptical form of "He won't like me (because I am) adding...

but as I was typing I realised that my sentence contained "it being" which I couldn't justify that way.

Oh well, back to the drawing board.

The second construction would be what I'd use. The first sounds awkward to me. It seems ungrammatical, though I guess it's not. It could be taken like this: "He won't like me, adding to his problems." In other words, not liking me adds to the poor guy's problems.

I'm with Kalleh on this. It reads to me as if the intent were, "Adding to his problems, he won't like me."

Old-fashioned Asa

If he especially won't like me adding to his problems, as compared to someone else, then I would use the "me" construction.

Barring that, if he already has too many problems then I would use the "my" construction which seems to stress more on the adding.

Otherwise it doesn't matter much, but I prefer "my".

Both forms have been around in normal spoken and written use for over 300 years. The "my" form is another one of those grammar "rules" that aren't rules but one person's idea of what the rules should be. The logic goes "---ing" is a gerund which is a verb functioning as a noun. Nouns need the possessive. Gerunds need the possessive.

Did you read the article linked above by goofy. It gives lots of cogent explanation of why this is nonsense.

I would only ever use the gerund.

But the common construction "...He won't like me adding to his problems...." is very difficult to parse.

My only suggestion would be "He won't like me (adding to his problems)"

The first part is a simple future statement and the second a parenthetical aside.

But I agree it's unsatisfactory and possibly it's easiest simply to say that it's an idiomatic expression.

That's exactly the problem I was having - how to parse it. The construction is perfectly standard English but it's a bugger to describe. I'm still thinking about it.

how to parse it

I took a quick look at the Cambridge Grammar of the English Language, and they parse it as the subject of the gerund (i.e., verbal noun). In one form, the subject of the gerund is in the possessive and in the other it's in the oblique (for pronouns which still make a distinction).

This seems in line to how a similar construction using the infinitive is parsed.

1. I want him to read the book.

They also discuss how the gerund (as well as the present participle) has nominal as well as verbal functionality. Old English used the genitive construction with gerunds. For the past 300 years or so, both the oblique and the genitive forms are used, sometimes by the same author.