separatedbyacommonlanguage.blogspot.com

You'll need today's entry (18/Oct/2012} which I can't link to directly because of limitations with my Chinese internet access.

Very nice, Bob. I love overegg. Definitely we overegg things where I work.

When s/he writes:

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I tweeted an expression that was unique to one dialect or another, in that its meaning was not captured by an expression in the other dialect.

But, then goes on to give one expression in the UK variant of English followed by a definition of sorts. I guess by expression the author means phrase or word. Sigh. We've been through all of this twaddle before.

I read this differently. The point, as I see it, is to support our "no such thing as 'no word for'" contention by giving a list of examples of words that are not used in another dialect of English and then explaining them.
The point isn't to suggest that these words are in some way untranslatable, simply that these words are not used in both dialects. In fact a couple of them specifically point out that the words have been imported into the other dialect because it's useful to have a word rather than a phrase for the concept in question.

It's also interesting from the point of view that if we weren't talking about two regional variants of the same language there would certainly be people trying to draw some deep and meaningful (and non-existent) conclusions about what it says about the minds of the two peoples in question.

Which doesn't seem to me to be the case here at all.

Can't see how any of that is twaddle, myself. YMMV.

Of course, you may well have a different take on the intention of the article, which I found rather amusing.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BobHale,

The point, as I see it, is to support our "no such thing as 'no word for'" contention by giving a list of examples of words that are not used in another dialect of English and then explaining them.

I had not noticed the scare-quotes around untranslatable. On reading the entry and not skimming, I notice your interpretation may be a valid one. NB: I still think the whole "there are untranslatable words" meme is still a bunch of twaddle.

Of course, you may well have a different take on the intention of the article, which I found rather amusing.

Author's intention aside. I did not find it humorous, just annoying. Must be that subtle UK irony thing that we provincials don't get.

Some of these are "captured by an expression in the other dialect".

kitty-corner: diagonally opposite
it's not cricket: it's not fair
overegged: overdone
antsy: fidgety
for England: to a great extent

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kitty-corner: diagonally opposite

usually "catty-corner" here.

Another Britism which is becoming common here is "roundabout" for "rotary."

I've also heard "zebra crossing" for "crosswalk" now that many cities are foresaking the tradional two painted lines at right angles to the curb for the series of parallel lines crossing the roadway.

Never heard your use of rotary.

What it usually means here.

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Originally posted by Proofreader:

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kitty-corner: diagonally opposite

usually "catty-corner" here.

Another Britism which is becoming common here is "roundabout" for "rotary."

Anything to replace that suicidal US invention, the 4-way stop. Just think, by installing mini-roundabouts at all the 4-way stops they could get rid of them all in a weekend and probably halve the traffic casualties!

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Anything to replace that suicidal US invention, the 4-way stop. Just think, by installing mini-roundabouts at all the 4-way stops they could get rid of them all in a weekend and probably halve the traffic casualties!

obviously you've never tried to enter a US rotary on a busy road.

If a "rotary" has the same rules as our roundabouts then there will be no danger - although there might be a delay at busy times.

Our roundabouts give priority to vehicles on the roundabout - which essentially means those to your right. In countries that drive on the wrong side of the road then the priority would be to those on the left.

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If a "rotary" has the same rules as our roundabouts then there will be no danger - although there might be a delay at busy times.

Assuming both drivers agree that the rule apples to each of them. In civilized England, it may work. In "every-man-(or woman)_for-himself" America, it often doesn't.

I think that's the problem with the infamous "4-way stop". everyone believes it's the other person's job to stop. But roundabouts convert a simple stop to a recognised priority. So the roundabout is, in effect, a major road and, just like any other major road, those entering it from a side road must give way to traffic already on it.

Those who disregard that the rule and barge onto the roundabout are guilty of a traffic violation just as would be a driver who simply drove onto a major road without according priority to traffic already on it. Even if no accident happens a traffic offence has been committed; it's not a matter of ggod manners and behaviour - it's the law of the land.

Alas many of the rotaries in our antiquated NJ road system (& those of PA & MA) err by including more than one intersection in the so-called circle. This can mean people are entering from the innermost as well as the outermost lanes of the rotary, often madly attempting to get all the way to the opposite lane (careening in front of those trying to enter) in order to 'catch' their exit-spoke on the nutty wheel.

Many of the spots where multiple highways merge are similar-- there wasn't enough real estate to merge those highways but they did it anyway. At least on the horrible rotaries, you can keep going round & round until you get it.

When I was a kid upstate there were lots of 4-way stops. They were orderly & quick: one pair of opposite cars go, then the perpendicular pair, & so on. Down here in NJ, where they've added 4-ways as population increases, everyone slavishly follows the oh-so-wrong drivers manual which claims whoever got there 1st goes 1st, one car at a time. There's lots of waving, smiling, 'after-you-my-dear-Alphonse', & it takes forever.

UK roundabouts are usually 4-way but certainly don't have to be. But if the intersection has more than 4, then it is usual for the roundabout to be larger to allow for the "lane-change" issue.

Mini-roundabouts tend only to be used at relatively poorly used intersections where all the roads have approximately the same importance (not unlike a US 4-way stop).

Of course some of our roundabouts are slightly more complicated.

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Of course some of our roundabouts are slightly more complicated.

Now I know why we broke away from England.

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Originally posted by Proofreader:

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Of course some of our roundabouts are slightly more complicated.

Now I know why we broke away from England.

Indeed. This was around the same time that you decided to drive on the right (that is, the wrong) side of the road.

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I did not find it humorous, just annoying. Must be that subtle UK irony thing that we provincials don't get.

Waaay back to the beginning of this thread (before we got into "roundabouts" and the like), as Bob did, I found the Blog entry humorous. And, by the by, you have all convinced me that there are no untranslatable words. So no more twaddle from me!

I have not heard of "rotary," Proof. It must be an eastern term?