Here's a word new to me, from a very interesting article in the paper. And on investigation the word seems to be very interesting.

Imagine a fistfight scene in a stage play. The article asked [quote], "How do stage actors convincingly beat the snot out of one another without actually inflicting pain?" It explained several moves in detail; here's one.

THE RIGHT CROSS (or what seems to be)
1. To line up the punch, A thrusts his left hand near B's head [a bit from B's right ear].
2. Then he quickly smacks his own chest with it while using his right fist to punch [across to] the space where his left hand was.
3. B's reaction to the punch – a sharp jerk of the head, a shoulder twist, a fall to the ground - enhances the effect.
4. The sound created by an actor to mimic the sound of a blow is called a 'knap'.

A quick check in OED hints that the word 'knap' (in two forms) may have a very interesting story. I'll stop here, so that others can enjoy helping to detangle that story.

I surely haven't seen "knap" used that way.

I was surprised from etymology online that it is a German word knapzak, probably from knappen "to eat" literally "to crack, snap."

There must be another root to describe your meaning, Shu.

Is that a specifically Briitsh Theater term? I've never heard it used in America, at least, not in Improv Comedy, which I have experience in.

Our discussion of "slapstick" might also have some bearing here.

Seanahan asks, "Is that a specifically Briitsh Theater term? I've never heard it used in America, at least, not in Improv Comedy, which I have experience in."

I came across it in this July 1 article in the Chicago Tribune. You'll have to register to get the article, but registration is free.

However, the term appeared in a sidebar, and since the sidebar had illustrations, it's omitted from the on-line version; I reproduced the text in the post starting this thread. (Interestingly, although the sidebar is omitted, the article comes up when you do a site-search for "knap".)

PS: This from the glossary of the Society of American Fight Directors, commonly <wink> known as SAFD. Fascinating list; I'm going to enjoy reading it.
Knap: A technique for creating the sound of impact of a non-contact blow, to help heighten the illusion that contact has been made. [It then goes into sub-types: body knap, cage knap, clap knap, partnered knap (also shared knap), slip-hand knap.]

This message has been edited. Last edited by: shufitz,

This is a fascinating discussion. The only way I've really heard this word used recently is by reenactors who learn flint-knapping to make arrow heads and knives of flint. It, too, involves a lot of cracking noises as the flint is snapped to a point. Here is a site with some information.

quote:

Originally posted by Caterwauller:
... reenactors who learn flint-knapping to make arrow heads and knives of flint.

That's the same process used to make clovis points, but I didn't know what it was called.

Tinman

Yes, exactly, Tinny! Isn't it cool? Have you ever seen it done? It's very interesting to watch, but the mom in me keeps wanting to say "stop that! You're going to hurt yourself!"

LOL

quote:

Originally posted by Caterwauller:
Have you ever seen it done? LOL

No, but I'd like to.

Tinman

If you go to Grimes Graves in Norfolk you can visit a neolithic flint mine and see demonstrations of flint knapping. There's some information and a downloadable video here http://www.roland-collection.com/rolandcollection/section/1/14.htm

Tinman,
There are loads of reenactment events all over the country, particularly during the Summer and Fall. Look up "Mountain Man Rendezvous" and your state to see if you can locate some near you ( here is one hit I got) . I've seen flint-knapping done at those events (although it's not as common as tanning hides and basketry) - the larger events usually have a lot of craftsmen. I've also seen demonstrations at historical sights that have living history, first-person interpretors, like when we went to Plymouth Settlement. Look around in your area, there are probably some good things lurking there.

I have clicked your links (though, I didn't load your video, Richard), but I am not sure I quite know what "flint knapping" is. Is it basically breaking off flakes from an original stone? If so, why is that fun? I haven't heard of it before.

quote:

why is that fun?

Well, to the Stage Age men who developed it, it wasn't necessarily fun, any more than hunting woolly mammoths was fun. It was a necessity of life. It was a skill, almost an art.

Nowadays, of course, some people learn the skill not to stay alive, but to get some idea of the difficulties facing our ancestors. It can be said to be similar to hand weaving or hand-throwing pots; no-one need do it these days, but some people enjoy doing it and find it therapeutic.

Right - well said, Arnie! I find it fascinating to watch because it really is an art, and because so few people actually know how to do it well. Anyone can chip bits of stone off of another stone, but to be able to do it in such a way as to create a spear-head or arrow-head . . . well, that's really cool!

Of course, this is an opinion from someone who set up a canvas tent in 100+ degree weather 2 weeks ago and camped in a long skirt, cooking over an open fire. INSANE? Most definitely!

Remember, flint is a very hard though brittle mineral (and also a very common one). A properly knapped flint tool will have a cutting edge that is as sharp as any steel blade. What's more, it will retain its edge for longer than would the later bronze and then iron blades.

However, once damaged it must be re-knapped - flint can't be sharpened on a stone life a metal blade can.

I do recall, though, that as is often the case, when new inventions come along (in this case the metal blade) the old ones still keep their popularity for many years - possibly hundreds in the case of flint versus bronze.

I simply never realised there was so much in this word! I hadn't heard it used in the context of acting before but it often seems to be associated with that kind of sound now that I come to investigate it. There are other meanings too of course.

Undated - The summit of a hill, hillock or knoll.
1470 - To strike with a hard shot sound.
1535 - To snap or break with a smart blow. Used specifically in the breaking of stones for a road.
1575 - To bite in a short or abrupt way.
1581 - To utter smartly; to talk, chatter
1622 - The clapper of a mill.
1680 - A cheating trick with dice.

I'm afraid I can't find when it started being used in the context of acting.

Who said it had something to do with acting?

quote:

Originally posted by Caterwauller:
Who said it had something to do with acting?

Check out the first post of this thread.

Oh <blush> right!

Back to flintknapping . . . we found some really cool Ohio Flint today while we were canoeing! I gathered up a few pieces, if you want to take that flintknapping class!

Great to see you again, Doad. I have missed your 'trusty' dictionary!

It is interesting how words can have such different meanings. CW's post on 'brush' was similar. I hadn't expected 8 different citations from the OED on that word!

We were watching Nova last night, a show on the origins of homo saps on the North American continent. One of the anthropologists was discussing the making of a particular kind of spear point, and the narrator referred to him as "an expert flint knapper". Fortunately, having read this thread I knew exactly what they were talking about.

quote:

Originally posted by jo:
... homo saps ...

I like that.

Tinman

In an article about the London bombings today, they used the word "rucksack." Is that a British word for "knapsack" or is that a different sort of bag? I hadn't heard of it before.

Yes, Kalleh, it is a synonym for 'rucksack'. I have never thought of it as a peculiarly British word, and Dictionary.com doesn't seem to think so, either. I would say that most English people would use it in preference to 'knapsack', though.

quote:

Originally posted by arnie: "'rucksack' ... I would say that most English people would use it in preference to 'knapsack'."

Interesing. But this song is from South Africa, if I recall correctly?

I love to go a-wandering,
Along the mountain track,
And as I go, I love to sing,
My knapsack on my back.

quote:

But this song is from South Africa, if I recall correctly?

German, originally.

Oh that is great! I love that song, and I use it often with the kids - I used it today in a storytime about camping. I wish I had seen this thread before then!

It's interesting that both knap- and rucksack come from German.

Apparently the Germans have a lot to carry around. . . . or do they just have a lot of baggage?

Arnie, I realize that the dictionaries don't say that "rucksack" is chiefly British, but I almost never hear it here. How about you, CW?

My sense is that it is more commonly used in England than in the U.S.

I've heard "rucksack" used here. Mostly by country folks or reenactors, though. Certainly most folks in the city wouldn't use it.

One term used often at the early American reenactment events is "haversack." When did that go out of common use?