Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
Hobbits and Geeks Login/Join
 
Member
posted
From the a news article titled Hobbits, orcs, and geeks converge on the Museum of Science's Lord of the Rings exhibit:

The "Lord of the Rings" trilogy is unique in that it has a broad spectrum of appeal. Novice movie-goers love hobbits even if they don't know the etymology of their name, while die-hard fans have spent hours on the Internet debating whether or not the mighty Balrog demon really has wings.

OK, I'll bite (on the novice question only).
What's the etymology of 'hobbit'?
And while we're at it, what's the etymology of 'geek'?

[I know, I could look it up. But it's more fun to share.]
 
Posts: 1184Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of jheem
posted Hide Post
Geek is related to Danish gak and Cologne German dialect Jeck, both roughly 'fool'. I remember reading Tolkien on the origin of the word hobbit, but can't remember it. From the Westron word for hobbits, I think. The true geeks will know it and let us know.

I was wrong about hobbits: look here for a nice explanation.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jheem,
 
Posts: 1218 | Location: CaliforniaReply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
The word hobbit comes from the Old English hol-bytla which means hole dweller. Holbytlan in Anglo-Saxon also means hole builders or hole dwellers.

In the Sylmarillion and other related texts, the Westron name for Hobbits was Kuduk or kud -dukan in Rohirric (the language of Rohan, of the Rohirrim). Kud-dukan means hole dwellers.

The elves of Middle Earth referred to the Hobbits as Halflings, a reference to their diminuitive stature, which was about half that of an average human. While the Hobbits did not seem to mind the term Halfing, Hobbit was the name they gave themselves.

Some scholars had speculated that the word might have come from the Germanic "hob" which is the source for hobgoblin. However, Tolkein's derivations for words in the four books are pre-13th Century, which would disallow this particular etymology.

Of interest to me, and something I have not been able to discern, is the source for the name Ents.
 
Posts: 915 | Location: IowaReply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Jheem, I just noted your referenced link. My notes were taken from portions of the essay written by Tolkein's son in some of his later writings, which I was about to reference. I am disappointed in this web site, which quotes still another web site, neither of which credit Tolkein's son with this bit of scholarship.

Interested readers might want to look at Unfinished Tales edited by Christopher Tolkein. However a caveat -- both this series of books and the Silmarillion are not the great "read" that the trilogy is and in fact are more for Tolkein Geek's than the general reader. The Silmarillion is a rather stodgy and pedantic collection of notes, facts, history, etc. and great stuff for curing insomnia unless you are a fanatical fan.
 
Posts: 915 | Location: IowaReply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of jheem
posted Hide Post
I am disappointed in this web site, which quotes still another web site, neither of which credit Tolkein's son with this bit of scholarship.

Yes, this is one of the side effects of looking stuff up on the web. Attribution is often lacking. I just assumed that it was mostly cribbed from Tolkien. Are you sure that Christopher Tolkien wrote about this? It seems I remember there being a discussion of what hobbits were called and called themselves in the appendices of the LoTR trilogy. I have to agree (with whomever) that holbytla is probably JRRT's looking for a nice Anglo-Saxon etymology of a word he made up for his first fiction book. I thought ent was from an Old Norse word for giant. But it isn't. It's from the OE ent, eoten 'giant'; our giant comes from the Gk gigas whence giga(byte).

I discovered Tolkien and the OED around the same time which is a nice little circle as he is listed as one of the readers for the OED in the prefatory article in the first edition by the editor in chief JAH Murray. (Along with the fellow, Dr WC Minor) who was in the asylum.)
 
Posts: 1218 | Location: CaliforniaReply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Back to the other of the original questions.

What's the etymology of 'geek'?
 
Posts: 1184Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of jheem
posted Hide Post
It's a loan from Low German / Dutch gek 'fool'. It went from this general meaning to sideshow geeks to computer nerds. Doesn't seem to have an older etymology or cognates in non-Germanic languages.
 
Posts: 1218 | Location: CaliforniaReply With QuoteReport This Post
  Powered by Social Strata  
 


Copyright © 2002-12