I am at a conference where the speaker, a gerontologist, asked how many crones were in the audience. While everyone seemed to know what he meant, I had to ask the woman next to me what that was. She wasn't 100% sure, but she thought that a crone is an aged woman leader. I couldn't find that definition in dictionary.com, though this Web site seems more illustrative. We've mentioned it 3 times on this board, with this citation being the most relevant.

Does anyone know more about this word?

Does anyone know more about this word?

An older, wiser women. Past menopause. One of those words that have been reclaimed by those to whom it was meant pejoratively (cf. queer). In ultima, from a word that meant orignally 'carrion, flesh'.

I have always taken it to mean an old, witchlike, woman.

Weren't the witches in MacBeth described as crones? I believe that's where I first encountered the word.

WM

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she thought that a crone is an aged woman leader

"Aged" and "woman", yes. I've never thought of it to mean "leader", though. There's an aspect of ugliness, too. Perhaps she should have used moisturiser more often in her youth.

My previous post concerned the new definition of crone, which is what I thought Kalleh was asking about. It's been around for at least a decade or two. I'm not sure about the leadership part, except to say it fits in with a council of elders (Latin senator is related to senex 'elder').

Wikipedia has a good rundown on the traditional meaning of the word crone or hag.

Yes, zmj is right about the elder concept. I was at a summit of sages in nursing, and the "crone" concept came up there. This was the second summit of sages, and they said in the next they were going to ask for crones to come forward.

Until this conference, I was ignorant as to this new use of the word and really wasn't able to find out that much about it. After I posted about it, I thought of the similarity to "queer," as zmj had posted above. I guess women wanted to reclaim the word. I can't see myself ever using it, though. I think of an old witch or hag.

I'm breaking my point here into two posts, the second of which will tie it back to "crone". (For this first post I'm recalling an old Asimov essay, which I can't find on line, but an abbreviated version is in this lecture, ¾ of the way down at the paragraph beginning "You have to understand".)

In legend a witch or crone is always evil old woman (never an old man, who is either a dodderer or a wise, respected graybeard). Raising two questions:

Question 1: Why was the old woman, but not the old man, seen as evil? (Not important for my purposes; I'll footnote a few thoughts.¹)

Question 2: What created our mental picture of how a witch looks? Appearance changes with age, but 45 may be too early for serious wrinkles (men and women), osteoporosis and sagging breasts. What's the most notable change then?

Toothlessness. In days before any sort of dentistry, a person would likely be toothless by age 45. Hence the lips would shift back, and nose and chin jut out and be more prominent, hooking toward each other. On a man that effect is covered up by his beard, but on a woman it would be quite striking to the eye. It's the look we classically associate with a witch.

If indeed "toothlessness" is the key feature a witch's appearance, then let's turn to the word "crone".

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¹Medieval life-expectancy was about 30-35 years. An oldster of 45, let alone 55, would be very rare. How would he/she relate to a society where spouse and peers are dead?

An old man of 45 can start a new family, remarrying and having more kids, and he has his adult children. Each keeps him "in touch" with his society. In contrast, a like woman of 45 can't start a new family, and may well have no earlier children. (Childbirth was often fatal, and thus if a woman survived to 45 it's likely because she was barren, never having to risk childbirth.) If childless, she'd also tend to lack the social network that women develop while raising children. Also (see question 2), her physical appearance may be quite unusual and therefore frightening.

For these reasons and others, she's more likely to become an outcast, marginalized – and thought of as at best a weird sister, at worst evil. Hence our image of the old evil witch as a female.

OED gives two definitions of crone. It has the familiar one, plus "An old ewe; a sheep whose teeth are broken off." [emphasis added]. Based on the above post, you can see how this could have led to the meaning "a witch".

"Could have" is not the same as "did", of course. Etymology is unclear. (The word was so rare, until the 1700s, that one can't feel assured that the earliest sense found is in fact the earliest sense used.) OED says, "As applied to a woman, it may be an Eng. transferred application of ‘old ewe’," although it leans toward another theory.

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I guess women wanted to reclaim the word.

That confuses me. So far as I know it has always meant an old woman. Where does the reclaiming come in?

Where does the reclaiming come in?

Well, perhaps trying to reclaim a posited meliorative sense.

One coould do worse than to refer to Ursala LeGuin: http://litmed.med.nyu.edu/Annotation?action=view&annid=1591

Actually, arnie, I had been thinking of that, too. I think the terminology should be that women have claimed the word. I wonder if the same will be done with coven. Perhaps at our next summit we'll have a coven, rather than some crones.

Wordnerd, very nice analysis. I, too, have wondered why, historically, older women seem to be feared, while men have been thought of as wise. You've provided some food for thought.

Judging by Asa's link above, this new use by women of the word as a positive description goes back at least to 1976, when LeGuin's essay was written.

I believe LeGuin was the first to use it this way.

Well, at least the first around here. (She lives in Portland)

Since the etymology seems hesitant at best, I prefer to assume "crone" came to us directly from the German word for "crown" (krone), as in Stevenson's A Crown of Silver Hair. Sounds so much closer than a toothless ewe, carrion etc! My kind of revisionism.