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I have to assume that this, too, is a "joke"... There has been a settlement at Worcester for at least a 1000 years and even the existing bridge, opened in 1781, is probably older than most of Massachusetts! Worcester sauce (invented by an Englishman and using a recipe that was secret until the intoduction of legistation that forced Lee & Perrins to show the ingredients on the label) is pronounced in the same was as the city. The Brother Cadfael chronicles, although set in Shrewsbury (a wonderful city), give an intriguing insight into life in that area some 900 years ago. Richard English | |||
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A fast-living micester from Bicester went out with a pretty girl's sicester. On a journey to Gloucester he carelessly loucester for that micester kicester sicester! Richard English | |||
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quote: The King Ain't Dead! Long Live the King! In your mind, my domain you're invading! My head on a stick, you're parading Through the Wordcrafter 'hood, But you misunderstood! I only referred to my grading. I wasn't abdicating. I was only cutting back on my royal duties, spreading them around a bit to my devoted subjects in an attempt to get them more involved in this thread. Recent posts, however, suggest I may have been premature and so, since your limerick here is such a beaut, let me once again display the inconsistency that my reign is famous for and grade it. Meter - A Rhyme - A Use of non-English phrase - A Content - F Overall - A+ A cracker! The King has spoken. | |||
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quote: This may be yet another case of me believing in what I was taught in grade school. I certainly yield to your expertise and see how the two terms can be viewed as interchangable though I do think a distinction can be made. Way back when, I was informed (rightly or wrongly) that "puns" were a sub-category of "plays on words" so that every pun was a play on words but not vice versa. A pun had to have that linguistic trick that made it humorous such as: definition of Kleenex - your daily nosepaper (daily newspaper/the tissue one blows one's nose with) where a simple play on words might be: And that, of course, would be disafter. (where the word "disafter" is coined as a nonsense word just to rhyme with "hereafter" and to make the limerick ironic, i.e. I'm risking eternal damnation for the sake of a joke that I never expected to be spending so much time delving into, still it's all in the day of a King so I'm not complaining.) As I've said before though, I've since discovered that my grade school teachers lied to me on more than one occasion ("White milk is better than chocolate.") and this could be just another one. The King has equivocated. | |||
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quote: I was just signing off for the day, not relinquishing my crown. I AM still very much open to anyone challenging me for my throne but it would take a handful of pretty damn good limericks to accomplish this. And, as I remain final arbiter in this regard, I admit to having a very slight advantage. Still... | |||
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quote: Actually, no. This was a "test." I wanted to see how outrageous a statement I could make and still have you believe I was serious. Odds were running at pretty much even that you wouldn't get it but the fact that you did not respond with wild and blustery objections to the effect that I was once again mistaken means you passed. Congratulations! Go have yourself a beer. | |||
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quote: Minor points off for use of "Piddle." Yes, I realize it's a place name but when you use it this way, urine trouble. A "B for your effort, R.E., assuming that in England "sauce" rhymes with "course." How about some new subject matter next time around? I Suppose It Could Be Worse (subtitled Woo-Woo! Now There's a Shot for the Photo Gallery! It's clear that with beer he's obsessed, And his views are shared in the Midwest. I'm glad thoughts unrefined Are not what's on his mind, Like what his King looks like undressed! An "A" for my effort because I'm in it and naked! [This message was edited by C J Strolin on Sat Feb 22nd, 2003 at 13:42.] | |||
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quote: Too many syllables in the last line. B- at best. Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. | |||
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Goes like this: It's CLEAR that with BEER he's obSESSED, And his VIEWS are shared IN the MidWEST. I'm glad THOUGHTS unreFINED Are not WHAT'S on his MIND, Like WHAT his King LOOKS like unDRESSED! Too many syllables in the last line, you say? While not readily apparent, maybe, I'd still say the 5th line meter is OK. Lines 3 and 4 are a bit forced though, I thought. Added points for the internal rhyme in line 1, for topicality, and for the likelihood that it'll peeve R.E. which, perversely, is always a plus. Ruts The King has returned (millions cheered!) Yet recurring themes have appeared. R.E., I fear, Will write more 'bout beer, While I just keep tugging his beard! | |||
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While it's true that almost anything Can be forced into a shape you can sing You may plead and whine But still in your last line The natural stress falls on KING. ====================================== B- still for CJ. Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. [This message was edited by BobHale on Sat Feb 22nd, 2003 at 14:21.] | |||
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. [This message was edited by TrossL on Thu Jun 5th, 2003 at 7:16.] | |||
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Richard Cory II (With apologies to Edwin A. Robinson) There was a young man named Cory. Folks thought his life was all glory. He went home one night, And put out the light. Next day they found him all gory. | |||
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This Limerick attempts to define That queue with its thirsty design Whose immediate goal Is a liquor-filled bowl. Now we know. That's the punch line. | |||
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Were it my own random use of a minor vulgarism I would accept this criticism. However, it's not and therefore I don't. Wyre Piddle is the registered name of a perfectly respectable and presently extant brewery based in Fladbury, in the Vale of Evesham. Their present brews include Piddle in the Hole, Piddle in the Wind and Piddle in the Snow. Piddle in the Hole is also available as a bottle-conditioned ale. I neither condemn nor condone their choice of company name; I do suggest that it is perfectly in order, though, for me to quote it! And so far as "sauce" and "course" are concerned - how else would you pronounce them other than to rhyme them? Richard English | |||
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Dear Richard, As English is spoken in America, the following words rhyme with sauce: boss hoss joss loss moss toss On the other hand (so to speak) the following words rhyme with ..... coarse course divorce force gorse hoarse horse Morse Norse source The difference seems to be in the phoneme corresponding to the letter "R," which English English speakers have, in many words, eliminated. Rrright, Rrrrrichard ?? When you grew tired of going to bars And gazing up at the stars Take a course in diction To eliminate friction While manipulating your Rs ~~~ jerry [This message was edited by jerry thomas on Sun Feb 23rd, 2003 at 9:40.] | |||
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So much for Webster's attempts to simplify Aemrican spelling and pronunciation! Here, sauce rhymes with horse, not with hoss! Richard English | |||
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Sauce rhymes with horse? There's not even an "r" in it! I can only say, if I am ever to visit England, I will be hopelessly befuddled by their pronunciations. quote:Thanks Jerry, and for that I had fun with this: A toast of sherry to Jerry Whose merry to Kalleh did carry A note very airy Nary scary nor hairy I'll ferry to Hawaii--won't tarry! By the way, I pronounce Hawaii to rhyme with "ferry"--just to give you all a heads up!  | |||
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Tghis brings us full circle to my earliest posting of the limerick (about an old friend of mine) John Rawlinson treated with scorn Any food that had ever been born He would simply not eat A dish made with meat Though he might stretch a point for a prawn In UK English this rhymes perfectly, in US English it doesn't rhyme because of the standard US way of pronouncing prawn as (something like) "pron". Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. | |||
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Bob, what about phonics? Or is phonics ("pr aw n" verses "b or n"?) just associated with pronunciations in the U.S.? Which is it "p or n" or "br aw n"? | |||
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Porn, brawn and born are all perfect rhymes in UK English Richard English | |||
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Porn, brawn and born are all perfect rhymes in UK English The crustaceans were viewing some porn But one small one lacked muscle and brawn "I'm eternally limp," Said that impotent prawn, "And I wish I had never been hatched." [This message was edited by jerry thomas on Sun Feb 23rd, 2003 at 18:53.] | |||
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Jerry notes, "The difference seems to be in the phoneme corresponding to the letter "R," which English English speakers have, in many words, eliminated." Just as a proper Bostonian will pahk his cah in Hahvard Yahd. | |||
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quote: Are These the Ones Served Warm? To R.E. I play second fiddle In matters of beer, they're a riddle. "Budweiser is piss!" Richard firmly says this As he calmly imbibes Wyre Piddle. P.S. If "sauce" and "horse" rhyme over there, does that mean "sauce" and "source" are homonyms? If so, how would the British say "What is the source of your sauce?" (something I'm sure frequently pops up in casual conversation) and make themselves understood? | |||
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quote: Limerick: B Your memory: D- (Are you sure that that's me you're describing??) My One Flaw is that I Tend To Lie About My Appearance. In looks, I'm your average Johhny, Bedecked in the best by Armani. My face? Well, it's just Like a Caesarian bust, Atop a body by Modigliani. | |||
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They are. And there are hundreds of other homonyms in English (both US and UK). We manage because we know from the context of the passage what it means, Thus, if I were to say, "...the dough will be bread soon..." you will understand that I do not mean, "...The doe will be bred soon..." since the conversations will have been about baking and not deer. Richard English | |||
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quote: Better! Much better! Always (sadly) topical. B+ History, Factual or Fictional, Repeats It's hard for a man to explain Cory's actions. My God, how insane! In fiction as in real life The mighty still feel strife. Don't believe me? Go ask Kurt Cobain. In Case You Were Concerned Though Cory was everyone's idol, Critiques of his life made him bridle. The grandest of all Often share in his fall. (Don't worry. I'm not suicidal!) | |||
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quote: I think just to simplify things I'll just give everything J.T. has written or will ever write an "A". In this one, I think I would have gone with "shrimp" in place of "prawn" in the 4th line for the sole reason of compressing all of the humor into the very last word instead of having both the 4th and 5th lines share it. You lose a bit of the British/US English incongruity that way, yes, but I think the payoff is bigger. (just an observation, not a criticism) Groaners are Acceptable (Encouraged, Even) in Limericks! The Wordcrafter poster J. Thomas With limericks is showing great promise. If he gains in renown I just might lose my crown And a new reign would soon be upom us. (Spare me your scorn regarding "upom us" since 1.) I love it, and 2.) there aren't that many rhymes for "Thomas"!) | |||
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With thanks, I am quick to explain My view of a royal campaign: Honorary's ok Gratefully accepted today But if dubbed King I refuse to reign. ~~~ jerry | |||
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quote: Sorry, Kiddo. After hanging him out to dry for "tops/pops/knot," Tinman would have my head if I didn't say something about "carry etc/Hawaii." Cram a few extra syllables into it by changing "Hawaii" to "Londonderry" and I'll give you a C+. Too Much of a Good Thing Now don't think I'm being contrary 'Bout your rhyming of "sherry" and "Jerry." But if the listener you bury With rhymes padded (very!) The text can be hurt, so be wary. | |||
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quote: "Refuse" needs a first syllable accent to work, which is a bit awkward, but let us not sweat the small stuff. An "A" Sing, Bob Barker, Sing!! The standings have reached a finality J.T. has declared his neutrality. I'll award him a cup Enscribed "First Runner-Up" With Kalleh as Miss Congeniality! As First Runner-Up, J.T., you will assume the title of Wordcrafter Limerick King if I am unable to carry out my royal duties though I don't think this is likely since I'm pretty sure I've bought up all the copies of those nude pictures of myself and Britney Spears. TKHS | |||
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quote: I asked that almost semi-facetiously since I was fairly sure the answer would be "no." Very odd. And yes, of course I'm well aware of the multitudes of homonyms on both sides of the Atlantic. They are a prime source of puns, after all. (The following was inspired by your "The dough/doe will be bread/bred soon" example: ) Either Way, Some Dough Will Be Required. A man with sore muscles proceeded To a masseuse and to her he pleaded, "Make the pain go away! "Rub me just the right way!" Replied she, "Yes, it's nice to be kneeded." (Heh, heh, heh!! Oh, my. As relatively obvious as this rhyme is I wouldn't be surprised if a near identical piece has already been written and published but still... Damn, I crack myself up!) | |||
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His Majesty, greeted with cheers From an audience driven to tears Said, "I have ways and means To thwart girls in their teens I can fight off an army with Spears." * ** *** ***** ******** ***** *** ** * The Baker whom you put demands on, Repeating the slogan he stands on Says, "As you well know I knead all the dough That I'm able to get my hands on." | |||
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Just out of curiosity, if sauce and source aren't homophones in the US how are they pronounced (phonic transcriptions or a link to a page with phonic transcriptions would be best - telling me what they rhyme with won't help as I'll have no idea how those words should be pronounced in the US either) ? Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. | |||
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quote: The vowel sound in "sauce" is like the aw in "I'm in AWE of your talent" or "AW, isn't he sweet?" The vowel sound in "horse" is like the word "oar" as in "He doesn't have both OARs in the water." Both words end with a hard S. In American English, "Tomatos are the source of the sauce" contains nothing even remotely resembling a homophone. | |||
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quote: My Daughter Says All Old Men Need a Hobby. It's not much to base a regime on. This Britney Spears pipe dream may seem on The surface to be An empty fantasy. As April, my daughter, says, "Dream on!" | |||
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quote: You see the trouble with that is that according to my dictionary "awe" and "oar" have identical phonic spellings (I don't know how to reproduce them here) and are therefore themselves homophones. This is why it's no use for you to tell me how you pronounce them with reference to other words because you and I don't pronounce those other words the same way. Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. | |||
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Found the problem ! Checking the word "awe" here with the "show phonetics" box checked, gives different US and UK pronunciations. It gives the same vowel sound for both languages for "oar" but with a more pronounced terminal "r" in the US. Vescere bracis meis. Read all about my travels around the world here. | |||
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I also am hesitant to try to type out phonetic symbols here but I never in a million years would have thought that "awe" and "oar" would be homophones for you guys. You may have had the language first but you certainly do seem to be screwing it up! | |||
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Then, CJ, you haven't heard a Bostonian speak. Hic is right; they speak just like that, putting "r's" in words when they just don't belong! quote: Thanks, CJ. I love the award, Albeit a double-edged sword. While surely my grade Is an "F" I'm afraid, It's fun being here on this board! I gratefully accepted the "C+", CJ, and it should have been lower. I realize my limericks lack rhythm and and proper meter--as Shoo says, "Better keep your day job"! But, I do have fun with them, and that's what counts. | |||
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In that case, it would seem that you would rhyme "horse" with "whores"! In the UK "oars" and "whores" are perfect rhymes. Now, please, no riding or pulling jokes...! Richard English | |||
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I spent my childhood in Galena, Kansas, a town named for a mineral. That mineral, Galena, or lead sulfide (PbS), was extensively mined and smelted there from 1877 to the mid 1950s. As self-appointed Poet Laureate of the Galena High School Class of 1948, I put together some doggerel in observance of our Fiftieth Anniversary Reunion five years ago. Sample: The miners came here to practice their craft; They got the lead out and we got the shaft. The current waft of this thread inspires the following ==> Lead miners, led to mine by the ore, Extracted the ore the mine bore To limit the crowd Signs said, "No minors allowed." No mention was made of a whore. ((( Quoth the Raven, "Never mined.' ))) | |||
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I pronounce all 3 of these words differently. "Horse" has an "s" sound, while "whores" has more of a "z" sound. "Oars" does not have that "h" or "wh" sound--just a long "o" sound--though hard to describe what the "a" does to it. I believe we discussed that distinction in another thread (remember, CJ, fire having 1 syllable?) | |||
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I obviously was not clear. In the UK "oars" rhymes with "whores" - it's not a homophone. However, "oars" does not rhyme with "horse" - as has been suggested is the US way. Richard English | |||
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quote: First off, I'll lower your "airy/carry/Hawaii" piece to a "C" or "C-" if you insist (I've noticed my grading is a bit on the benevolent side since my new grandson's birth) but this latest effort is a solid "A-"! Perfect meter ("albeit," a seldom used word, has 3 syllables), perfect rhymes (with the advantage of being visually pleasing - not all the same endings, "grade"/afraid" etc) and great content. It is fun being here on this board. The "-" is for the only flaw I can detect, your statement that you deserve an "F" for this one. It's a corker!! You didn't win "Miss Congeniality" by being overly self-effacing! You're really getting the hang of these things. Now care to try some double dactyls?? Go Ahead! Quit Your Day Job! Our Kalleh is sharp as a cactus. Her wit constantly will attract us. Her limericks etc Get betterer and betterer Through frequent and regular practice! (Royal modesty be damned, another "A" for the King! Perfect meter, superb rhymes with great visual difference, extra points for "betterer and betterer" and the whole thing rings true. My goodness, a bull's-eye!) | |||
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And While We're on the Subject If ever you hire a lover, Respect her as you would your mother, Since a week seldom passes Where you don't sell your asses In one sundry way or another! Meter - A Rhymes - C (Yes, yes, "lover/mother" is slightly flawed) Overall - B This may be another case of me speaking out for a minority point of view but I do not look down my nose at sex workers ("whore" is such a nasty sounding label) for the reason stated above. No, I wouldn't want my daughters in that business but I do believe that this line of work is worthy of far more respect than it receives. A sidenote: I recently suggested we open this thread up to any and all subjects but it seems like most of us continue to write about ourselves and each other. Don't know what that might mean... | |||
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quote: Yes, it is a nice limerick, but the meter is hardly perfect. Changing the second line to, Her wit will always attract us will smooth it out. It eliminates the extra beat caused by the stumbling block constantly. Etcetera and betterer rhyme while tops, pops and knot don't? If you had spelled the word out as etcererer, it would have been betterer. Tinman | |||
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quote:As the self-appointed feminist here, I have to respond--and I am sorry to add seriousness to this really fun thread. First, there is a term in the U.S. that perhaps you Brits aren't familiar with: NIMBY (Not in my back yard). It means, you can go ahead and build a home for juvenile delinquents, but please don't build it in my community! That is what you seem to say, CJ. Sex work is a respected job (you are correct that the politically-correct phrase for prostitutes is "sex workers")--but please, not for my daughters. Please--not for any woman! I have had the opportunity to work in Chicago for a semester with homeless prostitutes. Now, I agree, I saw the lowest end of the group. However, nearly every single woman had a history of major physical and sexual abuse (many of them by relatives, including their own fathers). Because of having no where else to turn and of not knowing much about any other occupation, they predictably turned to sex work. They often had AIDS, venereal diseases, were addicted to drugs and/or alcohol, and had a variety of medical and psychological problems. Sorry, guys, but there are some things that I just cannot leave alone. Back to limericks! | |||
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. [This message was edited by TrossL on Thu Jun 5th, 2003 at 7:18.] | |||
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Kalleh's a mean old disrupter. No one is any corrupter. She ruined the mood, Complained about lewd. Pardon this poor interrupter! [Perhaps I was a bit judgemental.] | |||
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